Hidden Harmonies China Blog

As China Re-Awakens, Finding New Harmonies in a Brave New World...

iPhone shopper, Li Xiaojie, stunned by Taser and tackled to the ground by two Nashua police officers

by 59 Comments

In all likelihood, Li Xiaojie was buying iPhones to bring back to China for resale, or as she claims, for relatives (and friends). When the Apple store manager in the New Hampshire mall refused to sell her more than two, she argued other customers were allowed. [Update: See Charles Liu comment below, Apple has lifted the number of phones restriction for the holidays.] Details beyond that are still a bit sketchy, but what caused the headlines in the U.S. press is that this tiny woman was stunned by Taser and then tackled to the ground by two Nashua police officers. All of that took place in front of her 12 year-old daughter. Brutality? No doubt about it in my mind. Court date is set for next month.



Chinese visitors to the U.S. have no clue how merciless law enforcement can be in this country. It is totally different than in China where citizens often can get away with screaming and yelling at the police!

Reader Interactions

Comments

  1. Do you know how the news in China is? Are they reporting this as well?

    Yeah, visitors to the US need to know that the cops here are quite aggressive. I know in many Asian countries you can talk back to the cops and they’ll just try to calm things down. But here if you talk back you’ll most likely get assaulted.

  5. Using Taser against customer is rather unusual in most urban police forces, but in New Hampshire or Southern States which have prejudices against Chinese I am not that surprised. The publicity will probably resulting the charges be dismissed, but for Chinese outraged by the Apple Store I suggest protest against Apple Company, demanding explanation and apology since the limit was rescinded after holiday. If no satisfaction I suggest maybe someone in the microblog will initiate a boycott against Apple products.

  6. Many people are totally not aware that in the US male police officers often use or often apply maximum force against women and girls whenever attending to any call concerning disputes or fracas. In many other countries, male police officers cannot manhandle female suspects. For example in my country, all police stations have female officers/constables as part of their frontline team ( armed squadmembers). The US is really far behind smaller countries when it comes to police work.

  7. There’s prejudice throughout the US, not just in New Hampshire and the southern states. It’s common in urban areas too. Actually, I was well treated almost wherever I went in the state of KY in the US. There are some very racist people but blacks usually get almost all the shit from the racists in the south.

  8. I just called the store in NH and politely asked if I can buy 3 phones for my 3 daughters for Christmas, and they said yes.

    But when I expressed my concern about the woman being tased, and that I’m Asian, they told me the phones are sold out and hung up on me.

  9. Charles, I hope you recorded that conversation. These scum need to be exposed to the light of day. I’m really glad I have always eschewed Apple products.

  10. I was planning to upgrade to a iphone but will hold until happle issues some statement to adress this. Well at least for Li, she has herself a multimillion dollar lawsuit against apple and ma police.

  12. Personally I don’t know why Chinese people buy these iphones. You see numerous stories of people buying iphones from Hong Kong and try to sneak them to China and got caught. There are plenty of Android phones out there and many of them are very good Chinese phones, like from Xiaomi and Oppo. Personally, I got a Samsung Galaxy S3 and wonder what I missed from iphones.

  13. this issue can be resolved in a number of ways:

    1) first massive media and internet exposure of this story; let the Chinese see how contemptuous the Americans in NH are towards their brethren.
    2) initiate mass boycott of Apple products in the leadup to the new year. this will also put pressure on apple in their leadup to finalising the iphone 5 deal with china mobile.
    3) do not stop until apple issues an apology, and the police officers responsible for the tasing have been fired. nothing less than a firing will be accepted, short of criminal proceedings against these officers and the apple store itself.

  15. Seems Apple’s mistreatment of Asian customers has been an on-going issue, and Apple was investigated by NY Attorney General’s’s civil rights bureau:

    http://gawker.com/5557498/apples-fear-of-asian-customers-is-being-officially-investigated

    I would like to urge HH readers to file a complaint with Apple:

    – call 408 996 1010 and ask for Corporate Relations
    – file a complaint about Pheasant Land NH store racial profiling customer and refusing sale, even called police and caused a Chinese woman to be tased in the process
    – fact of the case are 1) Pheasant Lane store admits there’s no purchase limit, 2) yet they singled out a Chinese customer to refuse purchase
    – Apple had been investigated by NY AG’s human right bureau for mistreatment of Asian customers (see above.)

    Thank you for reading this call to action.

  17. Apple doesnt really care about antaganising asian americans. They would care about putting of their growing china market. My advice is for those who know chinese, fan this story far and wide in the chinese media and social networks.

  18. Chinese people are often very superficial and fad-minded. They look towards the west for any kind of fads and will copy thinking that those fads must have some deep significance. Apple products are just one example. They automatically think that Apple, because they are so popular and stylish in the west, must mean they are a worthy product to spend hard earned money on (and Apple products in China can cost even more than in the west).

    I cringe every time a Chinese person say how brilliant he or she thinks Steve Jobs is (though I don’t doubt he’s very good at marketing). It’s shocking how naive Chinese people often are. They know so little about the west. I try my best to inform them that Jobs is mainly a marketing guy. That the person responsible for early technological success of Apple was Steve Wozniak and that Jobs is widely considered to be a douchebag and attention-whore even by his own employees at Apple. I tell them that I use to work for Apple and it was known to everyone that when you buy an Apple product that you are buying for a large “style” and “brand-name” premium, not just for the supposed quality. So even though I had an employee discount for Apple products (which was only about 5-10% off) I never bought any Apple products. I refuse to and I knew other employees who also refused.

  20. So after calling Apple Corporate Relations and filed a discrimination complaint (Case 385656098), manager of the NH Pheasant Lane Mall Apple Store (his name is Danny) called me back and essentially told me there’s no purchase limit on iPhone, and what happened to Ms. Li is none of my business.

    And he hung up on me.

  21. Hello everyone. My name is John Hugo. I am from Boston. Xiaojie Li, is my fiance and the love of my life. She was burtally attacked by the police for no good reason and continues to suffer from the effects of the physical violence, the emotional trauma and the loss of her dignity. She was not just tasered but also badly beaten, in what the police call “a routine arrest” The chief of police came on the television and insisted that Xiaojie speaks English and knew exactly, what she was told. This is completely untrue.
    I myself speak Mandarin, and in this language we communicate. I have observed incredible racism and bias from numerous police bloggers calling her “my mail order bride” and other such nonsence. We met in Boston through a mutual Chinese friend. She is a humble sweet lady, and did not deserve to be beaten and humilliated in front of hundreds of people.

    We really appreciate all the support from the Chinese community and indeed the world community in this matter. I would agree that loud protests around the world are called for. Otherwise they will get away with this brutality against an innocent Chinese girl, who lays in bed, covered in bruises and becomes fearful every time she hears a police siren.

    I would especially like so see protests against Apple Computer, as without their obvious discrimination this whole matter would not have occured. How bizarre that anyone at Apple would complain that somebody was a repeat customer. I thought that was the basis of a successful business.

    Xiaojie is a small unthreatening lady and did not need to be met with overwhealming force just for trying to buy some phones.

    Thanks to all of you who have helped set the record straight and defuse the racism and lies which surround this case.

    Sincerely,
    John Hugo
    United States

  22. @john hugo

    Welcome to America. Racism towards Asians and Chinese in general is so prevalent that you don’t need me to tell you. I lived in a place where not alot of Chinese to work there and I left there after about a year so I can live in a place with a large Chinese community which is more tolerant Chinese. Sorry to say that places like Nashua NH is not one of them. Right now I am being placed to work where there’s not alot of Chinese and I am already looking for another job closer to home. I am also planning to move out of this country once when I retire also because there won’t be much of this country in 20 years from now.

  23. @john hugo

    John, if you would like to connect please email the Hidden Harmonies editors. Please let Ms. Li know what she did was very brave. Almost like a present day Rosa Parks, she stood up against prejudice and injustice. I applaud her for that.

    Also I’d like to provide the following feedback:

    – Get a lawyer, call ACLU about Apple’s racial profiling of Asian customers. Like the discriminatory bus seating Rosa Parks encountered, it is illegal to for a business to refuse service based on race. Apple had in fact lifted the two phone per customer limit for the holidays, and Ms. Li is entitled to equal opportunity to purchase as anyone else.

    – Apple has a history of discriminating against Asian customers. See the NY AG investigation cited above.

    – The disposition of the two policemen requires scrutiny. Were they on or off-duty? If they are in uniform off-duty as rent-a-cop for Apple or the mall, there’s a huge conflict of interest for them. Their job is to protect and serve, but instead of protecting someone’s consumer rights and render justice against discrimination, they may have acted as agents of terror on behalf of the discriminating business in exchange for salary.

    – Do not let Nashua police get away with excusing their excessive use of force. Go to the police commission/citizen board and file a complaint. Taser gun has a history of causing accidental stroke, heart attack, even death, and should never be a part of any routine arrest. Next to lethal weapon, taser guns are extraordinary measure to protect the the police officers against violent offenders and Ms. Li never posed any threat to the two officers.

    – Aside from physical injury, has Ms. Li’s emotional injury been examined and qualified by a professional?

    – Do not yield to the “black market” smear against Ms. Li. It is no one’s business what people do with goods they purchase in a free society. Apple has no right to regulate how customers use their retail purchase product, may it be gifting relatives, resell in America or anywhere else. Should Apple screen people who buy iPhones to make “smash iphone” Youtube video? Again selectively profile Asian customers for refusal is racism, pure and simple.

    Good luck to you, and do not be afraid. Keep us posted on your case. Those of us who are sympathetic to your cause will do what we can to help bring this case into light.

  24. @Charles Liu
    Thank you so much Mr. Liu. My e-mail is [email protected]
    Your arguements are some of the most intelligent, which I have heard and absolutely on point.
    Here is my recent appearance on Fox news (national) http://video.foxbusiness.com/v/2034214773001/
    We need good people like you to help us right these wrongs. I strongly agree, that there is a double standard, when it comes to dealing with racism against Chinese people. Some of the finest people in my life are Chinese, and it hurts me to see so much unfair bias against them. They are an industrious, hard working, family oriented people, who have enriched mankind in their 5000 year history. Since I have been involved in this so-called interracial relationship, I have daily had to deal with unbearable racism. Why can’t people accept, that we are one human family? I look forward to working with you in the future.

  25. @Charles Liu

    John, I applaud Ms. Li for standing up for our rights and condemn her treatment by the Apple Store and the police officers.

    I agree with what Charles Liu wrote. I also had the same reaction to the report as Charles – the facts here remind me of Rosa Parks — if she had refused to leave her bus seat, would she have been tasered by Nashua police? What do they think they are doing there? Has America come to this?

    It seems the police of Montgomery Alabama behaved more civilly towards Rosa Parks than the Nashua police did towards Ms. Li. From Wikipedia:

    “When Parks refused to give up her seat, a police officer arrested her. As the officer took her away, she recalled that she asked, ‘Why do you push us around?’ She remembered him saying, “I don’t know, but the law’s the law, and you’re under arrest.” She later said, I only knew that, as I was being arrested, that it was the very last time that I would ever ride in humiliation of this kind…’ ”

    Ms Li likely felt a similar sense of humiliation – that other customers around her could buy 2 phones but she could not. According to the news report, she tried to document the discrimination by taking videos of other customers buying more than 2 phones, suggested she must have observed discriminatory treatment towards her.

    I also note that what she experienced is not new. There is a pattern to this discrimination, and there needs to be an investigation.

    This translation from the World Journal, a Chinese-language newspaper, in 2010 shows the problem seems to be pervasive:

    http://www.asiancemagazine.com/node/11374

    “Since May, there have been frequent complaints of discrimination on the part of the Apple Store against Asian customers who sought to purchase the iPad. These complaints quickly got the attention of State
    Assemblymember Grace Meng (D-District 22) and State Attorney General Andrew Cuomo, the governor-elect. On November 9, Meng’s office received complaints from residents over the phone. Two representatives from the Civil Rights Bureau were present at Meng’s office when the complaints were called in.

    Because the investigation is still ongoing, the attorney general’s office was unable to discuss any details of the case; however, the attorney general’s office did provide a questionnaire for consumers to gather information about the situation.

    Once aware of the alleged discrimination, Meng immediately sent a letter to the Apple Store strongly suggesting that the Apple Store offer a response to the recent and repeated complaints from Asian customers alleging discrimination. In addition, the Apple Store must answer to the attorney general and to the Department of Consumer Affairs.

    According to Meng, to date her office has received ten complaints. Customers have alleged that the Apple Store staff refused to sell to them one or more iPads by claiming that the products were sold out, among other reasons. Furthermore, the Asian customers claimed Apple staff questioned them about the reason they wished to purchase the iPad, how they would use it, and how they would pay for it. Some staff even requested to see the Asian customers’ driver licenses and passports.

    Meng has indicated that as soon as these allegations were made known to the Apple Store, she received a prompt call from the company wishing to find out more about the situation. She believed that the central office was not aware of what the employees were doing in the individual stores. She hopes that from now on, when Apple releases new items, such discrimination will not be repeated. She encourages consumers who face similar discrimination to come forward and to provide evidence.

    By Fang Meng, World Journal, 9 October 2010. Translated from Chinese by Connie Yik Kong.”

    John – thank you for standing up for Ms. Li. When I saw the report on Ms Li’s brutal attack, I felt discouraged. Later when I saw you on the news, I felt hope that the injustice here will be voiced, heard and corrected.

    Apple has a problem with resellers, but that is not your problem or Ms Li’s problem. If they want to handle their problem with resellers, the company’s policies must be carried out in a non-discriminatory way.

    This is a matter which the Asian American Legal Defense and Education Fund (AALDEF) may be able to help by offering advice on how to seek justice.

    http://aaldef.org/

    From Wikipedia: “AALDEF represents individuals and community groups that are most directly affected by racial and economic injustice: immigrants, the working poor and persons not yet proficient in English. From Chinese take-out delivery workers in New York and Nepalese domestic workers in New Jersey, to Vietnamese American youth in Louisiana and Bangladeshi voters in Michigan, AALDEF addresses the legal needs of diverse Asian American groups.

    AALDEF has litigated precedent-setting cases and won millions of dollars in back wages and overtime pay for Asian immigrant workers in the restaurant, garment, hotel, construction and domestic service industries. By working in multiracial coalitions, AALDEF has brought Asian American perspectives to policy debates and organized campaigns to stop hate violence, police misconduct and human trafficking. After the September 11 attacks on the World Trade Center, AALDEF defended the civil liberties of South Asians, Arabs and Muslims who were the targets of racial and ethnic profiling. AALDEF has worked with grassroots groups to promote educational equity and youth rights and to ensure that Asian Americans have a greater voice in the political process. AALDEF has trained hundreds of young lawyers and students through its internship programs, encouraging Asian Americans to use their legal skills to serve the community.

    AALDEF has a 20-person staff, including ten attorneys. The organization works with more than 300 volunteers, including pro bono attorneys, community workers, and students. AALDEF receives financial support from foundations, corporations, individual contributions and special fundraising events. AALDEF receives no government funds.”

    There is an email contact on their homepage. Perhaps you should write an email and address to their Executive Director Margaret Fung.

    Margaret Fung
    “As Executive Director of the Asian American Legal Defense and Education Fund (AALDEF), Margaret Fung is actively engaged in fostering a wide spectrum of legal rights for Asian Americans.     A graduate of Barnard College in New York City, Margaret Fung earned her law degree from New York University, where she was a member of the NYU Law Review, an Arthur Garfield Hays Civil Liberties Fellow and a Root-Tilden Scholar. Fung also received an honorary LL.D. from City University of New York (CUNY) Law School in 1997. Over 10,000 Asian Americans benefit yearly from legal counseling and community programs provided by AALDEF, which is a nonpartisan organization formed in 1974 to protect and promote the civil rights of Asian Americans, through litigation, education, and legal advocacy.”

  26. Thank you so much Ms. Fung. I am humbled by your support and impressed by your knowlege. I will take your advice to heart.

    Sincerely,
    John Hugo

  27. @john hugo

    John, sorry if my comment #25 was confusing. I am not Ms. Fung. My comment mentions AALDEF and suggests that you contact its Executive Director, Ms Fung (and I gave you her bio).

    Hope it helps.

  28. @john hugo

    John, sorry for all the wrong that has been done to your fiancee and your family.

    Don’t let this injustice die away. Fan the flames. Prepare the lawsuits.

    Reach out to rights groups and asian american leaders as Charles Liu advised. Also, spread the news on the internets to ask for their support (maybe make similar complaints to apple). Some blogs like :

    http://www.8asians.com/
    http://blog.angryasianman.com
    http://www.vincentwhofilm.com/aablogs/index.php

    Based on the facts I read, seems like constitutional rights were violated. Also, why did the MA police feel it’s is fine to state she has so and so much cash on her. Seems like a case of defamation to me.

    Get a team of lawyers and sue the hell out of apple, the manager, and espcially the MA police. The police should have been there to protect her constitutional rights! Lawsuits is only language these offending parties understand.

  30. @john hugo

    I’m sure your lawyer(s) probably have advised already, but get all the facts documented. Medical examinations, eyewitness accounts, etc. Even if don’t plan on suing immediately, you’ll have the facts ready when you are ready to.

  31. The people making satirical logos and t-shirts should have a field day with this.

    “Apple: We’ll tase you if you buy too much”
    “Apple: We will tell you what you like… and what to do. We own the police”

  32. I wonder if I can hire Nashua police to follow me around to “maintain the peace”. For $50 a hour, seems like super affordable security. Oh, yes, I know they are supposed to be following all proper laws, but if I’m paying the PD , who really believes I won’t be be first amongst equals under the police’s protection?

  33. Apple’s stock isn’t doing too well, so they are running a new promotion: “Free tasering with every 4 iphones”

  34. @colin

    I just watched the Cavuto interview. Cavuto tries to use the reported facts to blame the victim.

    Yes, he makes the ridiculous point about stealing technology. That is so inane and yet it is the kind of insinuation that would likely appeal to the average Fox News viewer. It reminds me of The Onion’s “The Beijing Olympics: Are They A Trap?”

    A second interesting fact is that Ms Li is a Christian. There are many large Chinese Christian communities in the Northeast (especially in the Boston area) and churches which are entirely Chinese-speaking, like the Boston Chinese Evangelical Church which has six congregations, ministering in Cantonese English and Mandarin, in Chinatown and Newton. Also that Ms Li is a Chinese business owner who owns some steak restaurants in China. These facts make Ms Li seem very familiar to me.

    The headlines should read: “Apple Store Cops Tase Chinese Christian Businesswoman Shopping for Christmas Presents”

    On the “why was she carrying so much cash” point, the fact is in China, carrying cash is common because many places do not take credit cards. Carrying large amounts of cash to go shopping is not unusual in China, where credit cards are not yet as common as in the US.

    See this guide written by an American who owns a Beijing Travel Agency:
    http://www.thechinaguide.com/index.php?action=preparation/moneyManaging

    “When traveling in China what is the most efficient way to handle payments? In many western countries you hardly use cash at all, using credit cards regularly. In China the opposite is true. Most small shops, restaurants and hotels will not take credit cards. Cash only.”

    “I always carry a fair amount of Chinese cash with me when I travel as its just easiest. For a tourist you will need cash for shopping, dinners, snacks…”

    **********************

    John should hire a good lawyer as quickly as possible. If the hearing is coming up on January 15, there will need to be time to prepare the case, and with the impending holiday, it may not be easy.

  36. More facts are emerging. We have hired a great lawyer. It turns out that Apple told her via e-mail to come to the store to pick up the I-phones. We have proof of this. Since this incident, they have refused to give her the phones she paid for, arrogently telling her uncle, that she must go online and cancel her order. She has refused to do this. The Chief of police in Nashua went on TV and told the public, that Xiaojie understood English. Being her fiancee, I think that I know better. People also say, that she has a white boyfriend, she must speak English. No one has even asked me if I speak Mandarin. I do. A pattern of lies and deception is becoming evident in this entire matter. But we have great legal representation and the damming fact will come out. I will see to it. I encourage anybody interested to get involved. The double standard of tolerance to racism against Asians must stop. Let Xiaojie be a modern Rosa Parks. She is up to the task.

  37. ive never been a fan of apple. even back when they had ipods, i said to myself, why the heck would i pay $100 for that when i can get a regular mp3 player for half the price.

    ive been thrown out of apple stores just for surfing the web. they told me this was not an internet cafe. their stingyness says alot about them as a corporation. this on top of the fact that they force their factory workers to comit suicide.

    apple stores give me the creeps. look at how they got these military looking guys working security at their stores. anytime you got dodgy looking security dudes, it’s just bad news. look at any other electronic shops. you just dont see these types of thugs.

    there are definitely way better phones out there. the meizu, newsmy are a couple of examples. also, there is ktouch, a phone that uses an operating system called aliyun. if you are bothered by google’s totalitarianism, then you might want to consider it. aliyun can run android apps, but they got rid of all the google spying mechanisms. good news to all phone users. China is coming out with a bunch of operating systems. qihoo, and baidu will both be coming out with their own operating systems. finally people will have a choice, at least in China. people in the west will still continue to be oppressed though.

    if you support human rights, you should boycott apple.

    as far as american cops go. it’s the norm for them to assault you and then accuse YOU of assaulting THEM. people are not kidding when they call them gangsters with badges. america seriously needs to be liberated.

  38. @john hugo

    What is wrong with you Mr. Hugo?
    You sit here and lie through your teeth about what really happened.
    Why dont you tell the community what you and Miss Li do for a living?
    Li and Hugo are part of a “reseller” group.
    “Resellers” are groups of people who buy out as much Apple product as possible, iPhones, iPads etc…..Just to send them over seas to turn a profit on them.
    Hence why Miss Li has over 16K cash on her. So her saying she was only buying TWO iPhones is also a BIG LIE.
    Why dont you tell these nice folks that your so called “FIANCE” was kicked out of the Apple store two days before this incident for being rude and disrespectful. OH YAH, why dont you also tell them she was banned from the Rockingham Salem NH Mall as well for the SAME REASON. Get it? BANNED/KICKED OUT/ASKED TO LEAVE AND NOT COME BACK! The two major targeted Apple stores, Nashua and Salem NH.
    Why might you ask??? No SALES TAX for the hundreds and thousands of Apple products you guys are buying. Which is ILLEGAL if your from MASS if you didnt know that? What do you guys care about legal issues, it’s not like you guys pay taxes on the fortune you make reselling these products. (Dont worry though, UNCLE SAMS going to want his fair share of the money you guys made).
    Ok, back to my main point. She was banned from one store and asked to leave from another store two days prior. Upon returning to the store, she was once again asked to leave. Instead, she chose to argue, not comply and to top it all off, she started taking pictures and video recording everyone inside the store….Which is why yet again she was asked to LEAVE. Once the Apple employees and management weren’t enough, the police officer stepped in. She knew exactly what she was asked to do. The I dont speak English thing is not going to work here. After arguing and being extremely rude to the officer for well over 10 minutes. GUESS WHAT, time to put the cuffs on. You dont want to leave when being politely asked to, fine its called trespassing. You dont want to obey the police after the words “Your under arrest” are said, fine its called resisting arrest. If she wouldve just left, this would have never happened. If she just complied with the officer, this would have never happened. She didn’t get “tackled”. She was struggling and fighting with the officer so much they both ended up on the ground. She wouldn’t listen and get her hands behind her back. So guess what people, instead of possible fracturing or breaking her arm. She got tossed and GUESS WHAT!!!??? It worked, she complied and the problem was done with.

    This has nothing to do with racism at all, so stop playing the race card.Now take it from someone who actually saw this Mr. Hugo, there was no police brutality, Miss Li understood what was going on, she wasnt buying TWO iPhone for her family. Stop lying, stop pretending. If my story isnt enough, guess what. THEY HAVE CAMERAS INSIDE OF APPLE AND OUTSIDE OF THE STORE AS WELL. Lets see you argue these facts once the footage is brought forward. She can explain to a Judge and Prosecutor why she was in there 15 LONG minutes after being nicely asked to leave.
    You should be ashamed of yourself, lying to people and trying to mislead them from the truth.

    Oh ya…. What kind of a fiance sleeps in that tiny room by herself in that tiny bed….

  39. @TheTruth

    This comment sounds very familiar… Are you Damir Cosic, the Pheasant Lane Mall Invisible Shield kiosk owner that’s been saying the same thing online?

    “Asian, Indians, Russians, Arabs etc… These people are the scum of the earth”

    Do you have any evidence to back up your accusation against her? When I talked to Danny (I’m sure you know him) the store manager at Pheasant Lane, he told me there’s no purchase limit.

    Also retail purchases are fully taxed at all levels, that’s why garage sale, or ebay/craigslist transations are not subject to IRS tax reporting requirement, as “private sale”.

    In light of these facts, do you feel your disdain is justified?

    I for one hold the belief in a free society, people have the right to freely acquire properties, resell their property in US or anywhere else.

    If the Apple Store tasered Croats for wanting to buy iPhones, I too will feel outraged. If I don’t defend your rights, then my rights are at risk.

  40. @TheTruth

    You’re probably right that Li Xiaojie is probably a reseller, but the problem is that Apple jacks up the prices for people in China, Europe because they can. While she seems to be clearly hoarding iphones to sell off to the grey market, there is no written policy in the Apple store that prevents her from doing that. Instead of trying to fend off Resellers like Li Xiaoje, why not lower prices of icrap in China so it will make grey marketers like Miss Li unprofitable to do that?

  41. There is no limit indeed. They do however, have a system in place as to how they are evenly distributed among these resellers. It is usually set up in a manner of two phones, per customer, per first come first serve basis among staying in a single file line that they have outside of the store. (Now this line is kept in the HALLWAYS of the Mall, to keep these resellers and their arguments out of other customers and the general publics way). Once the reseller buys 2 phones, they are sent to the back of the line until they once more reach the front and purchase two more phones and again go back to the beginning of line. So on and so forth until they are sold out of the wanted models.

    My evidence against her, is that I was there and SAW it. Also as I have told others, Miss Li does not speak English fluently, but regardless she still speaks somewhat broken English. If she can tell Apple employees what model, what carrier, what color, how many GB and how many units, she CAN and DID understand what she was being told when asked to leave the store by regular Apple employees, Apple management and the Police as well.

    Living in a State with sales tax and doing some christmas shopping in a your neighboring state with no sales tax is not a big deal at all in any way. However…. buying a few hundred thousand, if not a few million dollars worth of product without reporting it to pay the tax, is a big deal. It is very much ILLEGAL.
    Here you go my friend 🙂
    ****”USE TAX” is a type of excise tax levied in the United States. It is assessed upon otherwise “tax free” tangible personal property purchased by a resident of the assessing state for use, storage or consumption of goods in that state (not for resale), regardless of where the purchase took place. The use tax is typically assessed at the same rate as the sales tax that would have been owed (if any) had the same goods been purchased in the state of residence. Use tax applies when sales tax has not been charged. Purchases made either over the Internet or out-of-state are the most common transactions subject to a use tax.
    ‘For example, a resident of Massachusetts, with a 6.25% “sales and use tax” on certain goods and services, purchases non-exempt goods or services in New Hampshire for use, storage or other consumption in Massachusetts. Under New Hampshire law, the New Hampshire vendor collects no sales taxes on the goods but the purchaser/user must still pay 6.25% of the sales price directly to the Department of Revenue in Massachusetts as a use tax. If the same goods are purchased in a US state that does collect sales tax for such goods at time of purchase, whatever taxes were paid by the purchaser to that state can be deducted (as a tax credit) from the 6.25% owed for subsequent use, storage or consumption in Massachusetts***

    Also Mr. Liu, Miss Li is required to fill out the IRS Tax Form 8300. A form required when any purchase, especially cash, exceeds the amount of 10,000$. God only knows how many of these forms Miss Li has avoided. To top it all off, they do not pay taxes on the incredible amount of money that they make! Everyone else in this country pays their fair share. What makes HugoMan and Li so special? I wonder how they are living in one of the wealthiest area codes in Mass? But like I said, everything will crumble soon. Being kicked out of both of the Nashua and Salem NH stores will probably be in their favor seeing they can’t cheat the State tax system and dig them selves deeper. Those misdemeanor charges are nothing compared to the IRS and federal offenses racking up.

    Now, having said everything that I have. I will once more go over it.
    1) Miss Li has been banned from the Salem NH store.
    2) She was asked to leave the Nashua NH store 2 days prior to her arrest.
    3) Li and Hugo have not only lied to the media, but are also playing the race card against their own people to help a cause in which they are absolutely wrong.
    4) Although reselling itself is not illegal, it is however immoral. You have no idea how many senior citizens, people with disabled children, I have seen waste time and time again, driving around in the winter time to the mall to pick up a present for their grand child/child only to realize it was a huge waste of time due to the resellers buying out everything.
    5) Li and Hugo kept lying about what they were actually doing at the mall. They were not buying just two phones for relatives across seas…. If they had done nothing wrong, why lie? It only makes you look bad when you have over 16k cash in your pocket.
    6) Miss Li was given 15 minutes to leave like a civil human being, instead she chose to yell, swear, act like a child, question authority, disrespect apple employees and police officers alike.
    7) She was video recording, as well as taking pictures of plenty of different people in a private location in which she had absolutely no right to do so which was another reason she was asked to leave.
    8) She was not TACKLED by any means at all. She chose to resist and fight back against the arresting officer after he was MORE THAN NICE about the whole situation. It was due to her wild and crazy behavior that her and the officer ended up on the ground.
    9) Once more, she was given chance after chance to just stop resisting, put her arms behind her back and get cuffed. BUT NOOOOO, she was acting crazy and flailing her arms and legs making it more difficult to try and handcuff her. She should be thankful that the officer used the dry stun part of the taser instead of shooting her with the prongs. Owning both of these types of tasers, I can assure you the dry stun is but a mere walk in the park compared to the darts. If this was the darts, Miss Li would not have even had the chance to scream.
    10) This was not brutality, for if the taser wasnt used, they couldve quite possibly broken/fractured Li’s arm with struggling to get it behind her back. No one beat her, tackled her, assaulted her, or did anything wrong. This was blown WAY out of proportion. All because the video you see, is only the very end of this 15 minute nonsense. But hey….. There is actual surveillance of this incident, so good luck in court guys :).

    I do also apologize for referring to anyone as scum, but a lot of these resellers folks have pushed my buttons with how rude they are and to top all things off, before they were moved to the hallways, I have had merchandise stolen by a few rotten apples. I am not saying that Miss Li had ever stolen anything, but the groups in general have.

    So long story short, this could’ve been avoided if Miss Li just listened and respected being asked to leave the store for not being able to act like an adult.
    It could’ve been avoided once she was kicked out and asked to leave for a second time, instead she got even more rude, kept screaming “why” and “I have money”.
    Once more, the arrest could’ve been avoided once the officer walked her out the doors and was nicely telling her she wasn’t wanted there and would go to jail if she didnt just leave.
    Buuuuuttttttttttt nnnnoooooooo, Miss Li wasn’t having it. Absolutely no respect for management nor the police.
    Last but not least, ending up on the ground, being tased, being humiliated, walking the walk of shame through the entire mall, all could’ve been avoided if she just put her damn hands behind her back and complied with what she was being told. END OF STORY

    Stop the lies, stop the BS, no one feels bad for her, she had it coming from a mile away. It had nothing to do with her being chinese, arab, croatian, jewish, black, tall, short, skinny, fat. It had to do with her ignorance and complete disrespect.
    Mr Hugo and Miss Li, you should be ashamed of your self. You owe the Mall, the Apple store and the Nashua Police an apology. I hope you have the decency with what little self respect you might have left to plead GUILTY to the charges and accept what punishment may lie ahead. Clearly the tasing and humiliation wasn’t enough seeing that you are crying out poor me boo hoo hoo. Especially seeing that the minute miss Li was bailed out, she went right back to the mall and tried buying more phones once again! Truly unbelievable. Save us TAX-PAYERS the money and take a guilty plea to save the court house, the Police officers, the prosecutors, the Judge from all the wasted time and effort that they will have to deal with just to find you guilty.

    Hope this is a lesson learned. I will tell anyone and everyone the truth about what really happened. So stop making yourself look like a victim.

  42. Not probably, but definatly for 110% my friend.
    ‘
    I totally agree with you there Pug. It’s not even really about the price though. Fact is, China is a communist country and all the iPhones sold there, are very limited to what they can do. Internet access, privacy functions and so on.

  43. @TheTruth
    You moron. I was never even in the mall, when this happened. If you saw what was happening, then why do you claim that I was there. You also claim the I am a reseller. I have never resold anything in my life. You are just a hate monger, with an ax to grind. Why don’t you tell us your real name instead of calling youself the truth. Answer, you are a coward and a liar. I challenge you to produce a picture of me on the scene. You can’t because it is not true. I really should not dignify your lies with a comment. You have been busted.

  44. @TheTruth

    Sorry don’t agree with you there. First tax statement. Gees, since when it is a crime to buy stuff out of state in order to pay less taxes? Everybody does it, whether it is gas, cigarettes, alcohol, clothes, etc. And I fail to see the point to tell a moral responsiblity for a Chinese person to do it when Americans don’t do it either. States and cities create tax free weekend to entice people to buy so aren’t they are guilty also?

    Second, the whole point of the conversation is why Miss Li was discriminated in the first place to buy an iphone when other people can do it. Yes, it is obvious of her dubious nature of doing it, but she did work the system and she is legally entitled to buy the iphone. If apple wants to stop Iphone hoarders like her, then they should make it a better black and white policy.

    Third, WTH does this iphone purchase thing has to do ‘censorship’ within the Chinese government?

    Like I said, the problem of why this is happening is Apple selling iphones substancially higher in China compared to the US, thus the existence of the grey market for them. You never see this problem with the Samsung Galaxy S3.

  45. @pug_ster
    And once again, if he saw the whole thing, why does he claim that I was there? He is also lying about her going back to the store after her arrest. Her uncle went on her behalf to try to find out what was going on and to pick up the phones she had paid for. It is also bizarre that this guy wants to talk about my fiancee and my sleeping arrangements. Creepy.

    Just as a point of interest, Xiaojie has a large family in New England including her uncle in Nashua. Also she was taking pictures to try to communicate with the staff there. Not to cause trouble.

  46. @TheTruth “There is no limit indeed.”

    There you go Mr. Cosic. If there’s no limit, why was Ms. Li told there’s a two phone limit? The two phone per transaction rule at Pheasant Lane is also inconsistent with Apple Store’s policy. I interviewed the “store leader” at my local Apple Store, and was told the transaction limit is 5 units, without dailly limit.

    If the Pheasant Lane Apple store is popular and there’s a queue to buy phones, it applies to everyone. This is precisly the problem – Apple lifted the purchase limit for EVERYONE, not everyone except Chinese who may be reselling.

    “what carrier”

    You show your ignorance, Mr. Cosic. Carrier-specific iphones have contractual obligations; resellers buy unlocked phones.

    “few hundred thousand, if not a few million dollars worth of product”

    I’d like to see you back up your “few million dollars” accusation? Can’t? How about “few hundred thousand”? Just exactley how many hundred thousands? Let’s see some proof.

    Mr. Cosic, nothing you’ve said justifies the Pheasant Lane Apple store refusing sale to Ms. Li, or call the cops on her – the real reason she got tasered. So a short story short, this could’ve been avoided if the Pheasant Lane Apple store did not hold the same “they’re scum” view as you, and discriminate Asian customers, to begin with.

    Just ask yourself, how would you feel if the Apple store across from your kiosk posted “Croats not welcomed” sign?

  47. I’ve been a pretty regular Apple user for more than a decade, first with the original iMac, then Powermac, Powerbook, Macbook Pro, iPods and iPhones. Over the years I’ve spent over $30,000 on Apple products counting family and gifts.

    But this incident has caused me to rethink, and here are my conclusions:

    1. In consumer markets, people buy products but they also buy what the product stands for, i.e., values.

    2. Values can be marketed and advertised, but when people see how a company behaves up close, as in how one is treated and served, that makes a real difference.

    3. There is a lot of demand for Apple products, because they are well-made and user friendly, for the most part, and look good.

    4. However, some of the demand comes from “scarcity marketing”. Where there is true scarcity, there will be higher demand, and that is natural. But where there is fake scarcity, demand will also increase. This is what Apple excels at – scarcity marketing fakery.

    Here are some articles talking about scarcity marketing, and how Apple does it so well, that iPhone launches are considered textbook examples of this.

    Scarcity Marketing: Use the Fear of Shortage to Sell More

    How to Profit from Scarcity (HBR Blogs – August 31, 2007):

    “Marketers are trained to match supply to demand. Everything that consumers need should be available at the right time in the right place at the right price. Coca-Cola’s mantra always has been to be within an arm’s reach of desire. To be out of stock is to lose a sale or, worse, to lose a sale to a competitor.

    But marketers also understand that, by using the illusion of scarcity, they can accelerate demand. This false scarcity encourages us to buy sooner and perhaps to buy more than normal.

    We saw two excellent examples of this effect this summer with the launches of the iPhone and the seventh Harry Potter book. In both cases, the pre-launch publicity was designed not only to fuel demand but to create the illusion that supplies would be limited. In fact, there were very few supply shortages. In both cases, the marketers anticipated demand levels pretty well.

    As the mountains of press coverage and strong opening day sales attest, the scarcity illusion strategy paid off for Apple and Potter’s publishing company. It wasn’t just direct sales of these two products that benefited from the scarcity illusion, however: The heavy crowds drove sales of related products in Apple stores and bookstores during a relatively slow sales month.”

    iPhone 4 Scarcity Marketing Ploy or Slow Production? Posted on November 15, 2010

    How to Thrive on Scarcity: The iPhone5 Story

    “So, what does ALL THIS Apple and iPhone talk have to do with marketing? Well, as I said earlier, Apple has actually done a masterful job of building its brand on scarcity. ALL THE WAY BACK to the days of the Apple II computer in the ’80′s, there just were never enough to go around (even though there were warehouses FULL of those paperweights). Decrease supply, and demand increases….that is, if you have a product or service that people actually want.”

    Scarcity in Marketing – Why Marketers Use It. How it Hurts Us.

    Five Marketing Tools Apple Exploits To Build The Hype (Fast Company)

    “They create the illusion of scarcity to increase demand

    Luxury goods marketers have long realized that scarcity (real or perceived) makes a product more desirable and in demand. Scarcity not only increases the value of a product, it propels the procrastinators and all us who want to be part of the trendy crowd to step up and buy. That’s why it is a favored tactic of designer handbag manufacturers and other luxury goods. Apple has found its own ways to hype the sense of faux scarcity. It did not have enough phones available when it went on sale. Just one hour after the iPhone 5 went on sale for preorders on September 14, 2012, the Apple website reported that heavy demand had necessitated delayed delivery. Adding to the illusion of scarcity was the fact that you could only preorder the phone, and lines were long. The tactic worked. Not only did the iPhone 5 set a record for first-day sales, even two weeks after the iPhone went on sale, it was on a back order of three to four weeks, prolonging the difficulty (and desirability) of owning one.”

    5. Releasing new products at different dates in different locations creates fake scarcity….and drives black-marketers to satisfy demand in places farther back in the release schedule.

    Apple’s aggressive iPhone 5 launch schedule to reach 31 countries in Sept. quarter

    “The iPhone 5 will debut in 9 countries for its Sept. 21 debut: the U.S., Canada, the U.K., Germany, France, Australia, Japan, Hong Kong and Singapore.

    Then a week later on Sept. 28, the iPhone 5 will roll out in 22 additional countries, including Austria, Belgium, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, Hungary, Ireland, Italy, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden and Switzerland.”

    Apple Announces iPhone 5 Release Date Schedule For 54 Countries, Including Korea, Israel, Vietnam

    Apple’s full launch list and schedule is listed below:

    – Friday, Dec. 7: South Korea

    – Friday, Dec. 14: Albania, Antigua and Barbuda, Armenia, Bahamas, Bahrain, Bolivia, Brazil, Chile, China, Costa Rica, Cyprus, Ecuador, Grenada, Indonesia, Israel, Jamaica, Jordan, Kuwait, Macedonia, Malaysia, Moldova, Montenegro, Panama, Paraguay, Philippines, Qatar, Russia, Saudi Arabia, South Africa, Taiwan, Turkey, United Arab Emirates and Venezuela

    – Friday, Dec. 21: Barbados, Botswana, Cameroon, Central African Republic, Egypt, Guinea, Ivory Coast, Kenya, Madagascar, Mali, Mauritius, Morocco, Niger, Senegal, St. Kitts, St. Lucia, St.Vincent & the Grenadines, Tunisia, Uganda and Vietnam”

    6. Where do people resell iPhones? eBay.

    eBay sellers: iPhone 5 is yours for a mere $1,600 –
    People are selling the iPhone 5 at a premium on eBay in yet another sign that demand for the smartphone is high.

    UK’s first Iphone 5 buyer will sell it on Ebay

    “THE FIRST Iphone 5 buyer at Apple’s flagship Regent Street store will sell his handset on Ebay, he told The INQUIRER this morning.”

    7. When you look at pictures of all those people camping out and getting all excited about waiting on line and finally getting an iPhone….it makes you feel sorry for them because they’ve been had. They’ve fallen for the sales tricks and hype. And it makes you kind of despise the corporation that designs these scarcity marketing fakery to make people behave this way.

    I’ve got one! Jubilant Apple fans around the world finally get their hands on the iPhone 5 – so what IS all the fuss about?
    Biggest ever queue at the firm’s Regent Street store, with over 1200 people
    Fans queuing from London to New York to Sydney cheered and high fived by Apple staff as highly anticipated phone goes on sale
    Some hoping to profit from queuing, charging up to £900 for a phone

    8. If it were based on practical things like shipping time, then logically the first place iPhone5 should launch should be in the places where they are manufactured – like China. But no. They are made in China, then packed and shipped to these countries for the September 2012 launch of Phone5: U.S., Canada, the U.K., Germany, France, Australia, Japan, Hong Kong and Singapore. Why were these countries selected?

    I suspect these places are picked because of marketing reasons – these are places with significant global media hubs: USA for the Western Hemisphere, UK, France and Germany for Europe, and Japan, HK, Singapore and Australia for Asia. Launches of the iPhone in these places are sure to generate a lot of media coverage, which is free publicity for the iPhone5. Apple does not need to pay as much for advertising.

    iPhone5 launch in China comes 3 months after the launch in US, HK, Singapore, Australia etc. Product lifecycle for iPhone is 256 days according to this site. So by the time the iPhone5 goes on sale in China, it is already more than 25% obsolete. Why is the China market being treated as third-class?

    Can someone in Apple please explain why China is relegated to the same status as Albania, Armenia and Macedonia? (but just above Barbados, Botswana, Cameroon, Central African Republic, and Ivory Coast).

    In fact, Apple’s choice of release schedule illustrates a kind of rank order of social importance. Or perhaps white supremacy? Note that of the first 31 countries receiving the iPhone5 launch in September 2012, only 3 of them are nonwhite majority: Japan, Hong Kong and Singapore. The rest are North American and European, white majority countries. What is Apple saying by this? Apple Apartheid?

    I guess Apple makes its products in the Third World, but sells first in the First World, then waits until the products are slightly obsolete before releasing them in the Third World where they are made.

    And when there are those people who try to defeat the Apple Global Class Hierarchy, they are called “scum of the earth” by people like the commenter who claimed to be someone named “Damir Cosic”.

    9. The more I think about this, the more it appears to me that Apple is the instigator of all this conflict. This isn’t the fault of the cops, or Ms Li or the black marketers or Damir Cosic. It is the fault of Apple for creating this system of release dates and false scarcity.

    Imagine if you are a jailer with enough food for all the prisoners, but instead of serving it to everyone at the same time in the cafeteria, you decide to “reward” some prisoners and punish others. So the warden’s favorites (informants, cooperators, those who give sexual favors to the guards) get served first, and they get the food that’s fresh and hot and the best pieces. The prisoners the warden does not like eat second, third or fourth depending on how much they are disliked. By the time the last group eats, the food is all cold and all the good pieces are gone. This kind of system is bound to create all kinds of conflicts within and among the prisoners. Fights and accusations will break out. Some in the first group will be enticed to take food for prisoners in the later group. There will be a “black-market” in good pieces of food. This is natural and to be expected.

    Apple knows all this and yet exploits the benefits of phony scarcity marketing. Apple creates the conditions for these kinds of conflicts. Poor Ms Li has been physically and mentally traumatized, in part because she was responding to all the cues and signals coming from the scarcity marketing system that Apple had devised to create demand for its products.

    10. For the reasons above, I have now lost all respect for Apple as a company. It has “jumped the shark” in my book. As a company the values it stands for, as illustrated by its behavior, are revolting, and I will not buy any more of their products.

  48. @perspectivehere
    Wow! What an amazingly comprehensive post. I am way out of my league here. But I am very happy, there are such intelligent people out there, who can make this case, far better than I. Thank you for providing so many resourses for my perusal.

  49. Mr. Hugo…. I never said you were there when it happened…. I know you weren’t there lol. Never once did I say you were there when this incident happened, so why are you so hell bent about a statement that was not made.
    Yes, her uncle bailed her out and went to the mall still trying to buy the phones for her and the 16K cash she had. She obviously didn’t go in with him, because SHES BANNED FROM THE MALL FOR LIFE. “Pick up the phones she had paid for” you say? If she had “paid” for these phones, why in the hell would she have that much more money?
    You sat there and told the news reporter that to the best of your knowledge your “fiance” was not reselling phones. Come on…. what kind of relationship do you guys have that you have no idea why she is buying an outrageous amount of iPhones. Im not a hate monger, I just put all you and Miss Li’s lies on the spot.
    I’m pointing out your sleeping arrangements because if she is cooped up in a tiny little bedroom like that by herself, what kind of relationship do you guys have? Doesn’t seem like a relationship a couple who’s getting “married” would have.
    Taking pictures to communicate with the Apple employees…. WOW…. Another lie. What in gods name do you take pictures and videos of to communicate with someone who is asking you to leave?

    Never resold anything huh? With all the lies, exaggeration, pointing fingers, making up stories, I think your the head of one of these operations. Especially seeing how defensive you got about being there when I never said you were to begin with.

    Whatever it may be, all I wanted to get at was what really happened.
    Once again, please acknowledge the fact that Miss Li was banned from the Salem NH store, was already asked to leave the Nashua store two days prior and was given ample chances to leave the day of this incident. Instead of keeping it civilized, she chose to yell, be really rude and disrespectful. She cant blame anyone besides herself.

  50. @pug_ster
    She wasn’t discriminated. It had nothing to do with her being chinese what so ever.
    The censorship I mentioned about, is another reason as to why this reselling is going on. Chinese citizens would like an iPhone that has all it’s functions and accesibilities. Something that cannot be bought in china and creates demand for the unrestricted iPhones.

  51. @Charles Liu
    Before the unlocked iPhone came out, the resellers were still buying them out like there was no tomorrow. They target other phones on different carries, because with a little work, they too can be unlocked.
    So, no ignorance shown there.

    Few hundred thousand dollars worth of phones. Lets see… 16K in one day…. Thats a 112k worth of product in a single week. I’m sure you can do the rest of the math and see how quickly we get to a million.
    So, no ignorance shown there.

    Apple didnt “call” the cops. The police officer was there already doing detail. She chose to yell and be disrespectful. So yes, obviously the police officer got involved because she clearly couldn’t respect being asked to leave PRIVATE PROPERTY. She chose to yet again be disrespectful towards him and was given a whole whopping 15 minutes to leave peacefully.

    What dont all of you people understand???
    Get it through your heads and stop crying out with this discrimination and racism bullshit.
    She was banned from one store. She was already asked to leave two days prior for acting uncivilized.
    She was given many chances to just LEAVE!!!!!!!!!!! All this was avoidable, had she just respected and listened.
    I cant believe this…. If you guys saw the whole video and not just the very end. This would not be where it is right now. Imagine if you had your own business. You kicked someone out and there back again causing problems, being rude, yelling, disrupting other customers. If this was your store and this happened, it would of course be a different story.
    God forbid that because of her stubborn and nasty attitude and non-compliance, the police officer broke her arm by accident because she just wouldn’t listen and would not let go of her grip. What then???? That would be one shit show. So guess what, they did the right thing!!! I own a dry stun taser, it’s not a big deal, its a walk in the park compared to the taser gun as well as pepper spray.

    This ignorance has been going on long enough. This was not brutality, racism or any of that. It was a person who had no respect for other people, private property nor the police. END OF STORY.

    One more thing, whats with the “croat”…..Im not croatian my friend.

  52. @TheTruth

    TheTruth :
    @pug_ster
    She wasn’t discriminated. It had nothing to do with her being chinese what so ever.
    The censorship I mentioned about, is another reason as to why this reselling is going on. Chinese citizens would like an iPhone that has all it’s functions and accesibilities. Something that cannot be bought in china and creates demand for the unrestricted iPhones.

    Oh please, if Chinese netizens was so worried about ‘Chinese censored version of iphones,’ wouldn’t Chinese netizens flocking to buy US version of Android phones (IE Samsung Galaxy S3) also? Chinese people simply buy grey market iphones from the US because it is essentially the same product for a lower price. So stop this racist rant of yours.

    So let’s say that she is selling thousands of dollars worth of phones. Who is she ripping off? Apple? Oh ppllleaassee… Apple is already making billions of dollars every quarter. Apple already made off from Li 200% markup of every phone she brought from them anyways. So Apple made 2x profit in the US instead 3x profit from China. Does anybody feel sorry for Apple here?

  53. An official version unlocked 16 GB iPhone 5 in China sells for Y5288. The higher price over one in the US, or Hong Kong for that matter, is almost entirely due to the built-in VAT (at 17%) in China. There are lower prices in China, but those are mostly shipped from Hong Kong, and some from the US, bypassing VAT. The margin is so thin that I doubt being a reseller considered the risk is any profitable at all.

    The reason why Apple started selling iPhone 5 later in China, is almost entirely due to the time it normal takes to get a “Network Access License” in China. Apple didn’t get it until late November, right after which it started selling iPhone 5.

    It’s a globalized almost friction-less capitalistic world, and Apple isn’t stupid to leave an arbitrage opportunity to others, with the quantity of iPhones they are selling. A store manager or some mall cops though, can be jackasses.

  54. Mr Truth wrote:

    5) Li and Hugo kept lying about what they were actually doing at the mall. They were not buying just two phones for relatives across seas…. If they had done nothing wrong, why lie? It only makes you look bad when you have over 16k cash in your pocket.

    And also:
    Mr. Hugo…. I never said you were there when it happened…. I know you weren’t there lol. Never once did I say you were there when this incident happened, so why are you so hell bent about a statement that was not made.

    This is where this guy claims I was in the mall. He can’t even remember his own posts. It is hard for him to keep so many lies straight.

    Chinese people frequently pay cash, instead of credit card. I myself wish I had enough brains to do that myself. I am saddled with about $8,000.00 in credit card debt. I am by the way, not in charge of a huge international conspiracy.

    Xiaojie can carry as much cash as she likes. She has earned it. Sounds like some loser is jealous.

    Mr truth wrote:
    Never resold anything huh? With all the lies, exaggeration, pointing fingers, making up stories, I think your the head of one of these operations. Especially seeing how defensive you got about being there when I never said you were to begin with.

    He does not present a shread of evidence. I don’t even own a single MAC product. I am a PC guy. I even got A+ certified about 10 years ago because I like Microsoft so much. I work very hard at my job, and have nothing but contempt for cowards like Mr Truth who refuse to tell us their real name.

    Mr truth wrote:
    I’m pointing out your sleeping arrangements because if she is cooped up in a tiny little bedroom like that by herself, what kind of relationship do you guys have? Doesn’t seem like a relationship a couple who’s getting “married” would have.

    The fact is, that we do not yet live together yet. She is a conservative woman and has children at home.
    So who cares where she sleeps? Anyway it is nobodys business what we do in private. Mr Truth sounds like a sexually fustrated loser, who gets off seeing a woman beaten.

    I am not responding to any more of his BS hate posts. This will only encourage him.

  55. @TheTruth

    Mr. Cosic, private property does not mean Apple is free to discriminate on sale of their product. The purchase limit was lifted prior to the store denying Ms. Li’s purchase.

    Do you know who Rosa Parks is? Do you know America used to have “whites only” lunch counter? Those are illegal now. If you didn’t go to school in America (or slept thru it) please educate yourself.

  56. @TheTruth
    @Charles Liu
    @john hugo

    Regarding comments by TheTruth (whom many suspect is the same person as the commenter who identifies himself as “Damir Cosic”, owner of the Invisible Shield Kiosk in front of the Apple Store at the Pheasant Lane Mall in various comments posted at various news websites):

    His comments make a number of accusations against Ms Li which are extremely negative and nonsensical, particularly the comments regarding sales tax.

    How credible are these negative comments? In my view, if MrTruth/aka/Damir Cosic is indeed owner of the Invisible Shield Kiosk, the credibility of his comments need to be discounted by the dependent relationship that Invisible Shield business has to the Apple Store.

    What exactly is an “Invisible Shield” and what relationship does it have with the Apple Store?

    When I google the terms “Invisible Shield” and “Apple Store” and “iPhone”, I find 63,100 ghits. There are so many ghits because the Invisible Shield is a protective film that can be applied to an iPhone, iPad and other Apple products. Invisible Shield is a business that depends on sales of Apple Store products.

    Presumably, customers of the Apple Store would purchase protective film from the Invisible Shield Kiosk after making product purchases at the Apple Store. Presumably, the business of the Invisible Shield Kiosk at the Pheasant Lane Mall is highly dependent on having good relations with the management and sales staff of the Apple Store, so that the Apple Store would refer their customers to the Invisible Shield Kiosk outside. Conversely, if the Apple Store staff would not so refer their customers, this would hurt the Invisible Shield Kiosk’s business. So it would be quite natural for the two stores to have a “I scratch your back you scratch mine” type of relationship (although the Apple Store is far bigger than the Invisible Shield).

    Given this relationship, there is a strong incentive for MrTruth/Damir Cosic to be making false or exaggerated statements about Ms Li in order to enhance his relationship with the management and sales staff of the Apple Store.

    Another reason to doubt MrTruth/Damir Cosic’s credibility is that another commenter/eyewitness contradicts MrTruth/aka Damir Cosic’s account, and is consistent with Ms Li’s account through her daughter, uncle and fiance.

    Commenting on this article on the CNet.com website, Woman Tasered after trying to buy too many iPhones: A woman trying to buy too many iPhones at a New Hampshire Apple store and ends up being Tasered by police outside the store” by Chris Matyszczyk December 12, 2012 6:39 PM PST, a reader identified as “Seth Holladay” wrote “I was there for this. She was acting a little frantic, but I think it’s because she thought she was being discriminated against or something similar. The taser was definitely uncalled for.”

    Mr Holladay’s perspective is very different from MrTruth/Damir Cosic’s version. Hopefully, Ms Li’s attorneys will be able to locate Seth Holladay and obtain his testimony.

    ******************

    MrTruth/Damir Cosic’s rant about sales tax is so wildly off-the-wall, one has to wonder about his grip on reality. The fact is, Nashua’s economic existence depends upon shoppers from Massachusetts and other states seeking to avoid Massachusetts sales tax.

    New Hampshire is one of 4 states in the USA (others are Alaska, Delaware and Oregon) that charge no sales tax. NH policy is to give its retailers an advantage over nearby states.

    According to UNH professor Neil Niman, “We’ve built our retail economy on the advantages of no sales tax…”
    NH politicians are actively fighting a proposal for sales over the internet to be charged sales tax of the state of the buyer.

    And the Pheasant Lane Mall itself is configured to avoid Massachusetts sales tax. According to Wikipedia, the Pheasant Lane Mall is built just over the Massachusetts border. In fact, the Mall’s is built on a property that lies in both New Hampshire and Massachusetts, but the Mall itself is built on the NH side of the property. A corner of one of the stores in the Mall had to be redesigned to an odd pentagonal shape to avoid the corner falling into the Massachusetts side, thereby subjecting the entire mall to MA sales tax!

    From Wikipedia: “The rise of South Nashua spurred by Pheasant Lane Mall has elevated Nashua’s municipal identity beyond gateway to New Hampshire, and helped create its current status as part of the Greater Boston economic area, and a hub for surrounding bedroom communities.

    The nature of building on a border between a state with no sales tax (New Hampshire) and a state with one (Massachusetts) was shown in the changing plans and problems. Originally, the mall was to straddle the border, with retail on the no-sales-tax side. Restaurants were to be on the opposite end, since Massachusetts has a lower meals tax. However, the government of Massachusetts declared all customers, in all stores, would have to pay sales tax to Massachusetts. Therefore, the mall was redesigned so that all stores and restaurants were on the New Hampshire side of the border. However, the site lines had been drawn up incorrectly, placing one corner of the JCPenney building in Massachusetts. Consequently, the corner of JCPenney was cut off and re-bricked into its current pentagonal shape.”

    Given this background, MrTruth/Damir Cosic rant against customers like Ms Li or resellers coming to the mall to avoid MA sales tax seems exceedingly bizarre and nonsensical. The bizarre rant against shoppers avoiding sales tax further reduces MrTruth/Damir Cosic’s credibility.

    This is because his rant sounds like an attempt to come up with as many arguments as possible to smear Ms Li, accuse her of reselling, and generally smear resellers (using such terms as “scum of the earth”, as Charles noted). Reading his comments, one does not sense factual eyewitness reporting, but rather the ranting and raving of someone with an ax to grind. If I were sitting on a jury or judging the two statements, I would find Mr Holladay’s statement much more credible than the extended statements of MrTruth/aka Damir Cosic’s, which go well beyond facts and well into subjective opinion.

  57. damir cosic,
    you just lost yourself a whole bunch of potential customers and business. It won’t be long until a human flesh search sends out the bulletin with your mugshot and business photos warning Chinese and other customers not to do business with your stall.

  58. Charles Liu :
    Apparently Nashua police has a history of using excessive force:
    [youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfVQaabWeuw?version=3&rel=1&fs=1&showsearch=0&showinfo=1&iv_load_policy=1&wmode=transparent&w=640&h=390%5D

    The recent news about Lisa Steed, the Utah state trooper, who was fired for falsifying Driving Under the Influence (DUI) cases and is now being sued, puts a certain important perspective on policing, media, assumptions and justice.

    For years, Lisa Steed was seen as a “Super Trooper”, winning a ‘Utah Highway Patrol Trooper of the Year’ award in 2007.

    Google “Lisa Steed” and you can see articles from various dates, and how they have changed over the years. in 2007, she was regarded as a hero:

    2007: Trooper of the Year named
    THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
    PUBLISHED NOVEMBER 12, 2007 8:37 AM
    This is an archived article that was published on sltrib.com in 2007, and information in the article may be outdated. It is provided only for personal research purposes and may not be reprinted.
    Posted: 1:53 PM- Utah Highway Patrol Officer Lisa Steed is the Utah Highway Patrol’s new Trooper of the Year. The Utah Department of Public Safety made the announcement after Steed made more than 200 DUI arrests this year.

    Colleagues say the West Point resident is the first woman to receive the honor, which is annually selected by UHP’s Honorary Colonels. Steed will also be awarded the Public Safety Star for extraordinary acts or accomplishments.

    Sgt. Shane Nordfelt is Steed’s immediate supervisor with UHP. Nordfelt says the award is in recognition of outstanding police work and a community-based approach to public service.

    ”She’s a great asset for the citizens of Utah to have working on the highway patrol,” Nordfelt said. ”She works well with the public, she’ll stop for motorists that need help, changing tires or getting off the freeway.”

    Nordfelt called her ”a little ball of fire and energy.”

    Fellow troopers say Steed has a remarkable record of police work. In her five-year career, she’s made more than 750 arrests for driving under the influence of a controlled substance, and more than 1,200 total arrests.

    Thus far in 2007, Steed has stopped more than 2,000 cars.

    ”She’s got a work ethic that’s second to none,” said Kim Farnsworth, with the UHP. ”I’ve never seen anyone work so hard.”

    Steed is also known for her willingness to help other officers. A graduate of Weber State University, Steed holds a bachelor’s degree in criminal justice. She worked as a dispatcher while attending school.

    Steed shares credit for the award with her fellow officers.

    ”Without the people I work with and the sergeant’s and lieutenant’s support, I couldn’t have made it to these goals,” she said.

    ************************

    But there were accusations by people she arrested that they had done nothing wrong. She arrested thousands of people, many of whom went to jail on her reports of driving while intoxicated on alcohol or drugs. Throughout these protests, her work was publicly supported by her superiors.

    In this article from 2010, Lisa Steed is criticized for having used a taser on a driver who refused to get out of his car because he insisted on talking to his lawyer. Watch the video and read the text of this article. Note that in 2010, the police management defend her performance and dismiss victim and public protestations.

    “On March 28, 2009, at 1:18 a.m., Utah Highway Patrol trooper Cpl. Lisa Steed pulled over a 24-year-old driver on State Street in South Salt Lake.

    When he rolled down his window, she stuck a portable breath test [PBT] device in his face. She could smell alcohol and wanted to see if it was coming from him, she told the driver.

    “I would like to speak to my lawyer,” he said.

    Steed opened his car door and told him to get out.

    In a digital video recording of his arrest which City Weekly obtained through an open-records request, the driver can be seen remaining in his car and asking repeatedly, “Excuse me, ma’am, I’d like to speak to my legal representative first.”

    Steed unholstered her Taser. She told him to get out of the car, “or you’re going to get tased, sir, in two seconds.”

    “Less than two minutes into the traffic stop, Steed pressed her Taser into his left shoulder, an approach called “drive-tasing,” akin to using a Taser as a cattle prod. His screams are chillingly audible on the traffic-stop video, recorded by Steed’s dashboard camera. (UHP policy requires that all traffic stops be recorded.) Almost before the driver had time to react, Steed drive-tased him again, his screams accompanied by the cries of his distraught passenger.

    “When you’re told to get out of the car, that’s what you do,” Steed informed the driver after he exited his vehicle.

    While she did not defend the driver, when shown the video, DUI defense attorney Tara Isaacson found Steed’s use of force on a driver whose conduct was respectful “truly shocking. Tasers are used as a last resort. You don’t start an investigation with them.”

    The UHP doesn’t see a problem with the method. Steed, in an e-mail, says Tasers are used “to avoid going hands-on with individuals and risk injury to the officer or subject.” The driver, whom she says subsequently tested positive for alcohol and marijuana use, refused to comply with her orders, so she tased him. The only problem with the stop, says Steed’s supervisor, UHP Lt. Steve Winward, “was a slight policy violation,” because Steed asked the driver to blow into the PBT prior to requesting that he perform field sobriety tests, contrary to UHP policy. Another UHP official preferred the word “deviation” to “violation.”

    In the wake of Utah relaxing its private-club laws in July 2009, Steed’s rise to fame and fortune (she earned $82,953 in 2009, according to Utah’s Right to Know Website) might well represent a triumph of law and order for nondrinkers. Utah’s Legislature certainly admires her. Two weeks after then-Senate Majority Leader Sheldon Killpack’s Jan. 16, 2010, arrest for driving under the influence of alcohol in Salt Lake City, Utah lawmakers honored 32-year-old Steed for her work nailing drunken drivers.

    In 2009, Steed racked up an extraordinary 400 DUI arrests, twice the number of any other UHP trooper. Senate President Michael Waddoups, R-Taylorsville, congratulated Steed for what was “probably a national record” and said that to average more than two DUI busts a day “was phenomenal,” according to a Jan. 29 blogpost on DeseretNews.com written by Lisa Riley Roche.

    Steed told the Deseret News, when reporter Geoff Liesik accompanied her on a ride-along, that the secret to her success was, “It’s a lot of hard work, but you make a ton of stops, and you’re going to run into [DUIs].”

    Steed is also the brightest star in the UHP’s firmament…..Steed, Rapich proudly says, is “unbelievably effective and efficient” at removing impaired drivers from Utah’s streets and represents “the best of the best.”

    But when Callis Sturgill heard that Utah legislators had honored Steed, he all but wept in bitterness. “She’s a dishonest cop,” he says. Five years after Steed arrested him for a DUI, Sturgill says her “baseless” arrest has left him in financial ruin.”

    **********************
    The tasering case was later settled:

    State settles taser lawsuit

    SALT LAKE CITY (ABC 4 News) – The State of Utah has now settled a taser lawsuit against controversial Utah Highway Patrol Trooper Lisa Steed.

    While not admitting guilt, the state paid a significant amount to a man Steed tasered while he was sitting in his car.

    Tuesday, we told you Salt Lake’s District Attorney is now reviewing dozens of Steed’s cases.

    And first thing Wednesday morning, we got the news that the state paid tens of thousands to settle this Steed suit.

    The lawsuit stems from an incident in March of 2009.

    That’s when Trooper Steed stopped Ryan Jones.

    Several times, Steed asked Jones to follow her orders.

    He asked to call a lawyer.

    She then tasered him while he sat in his car.

    A civil lawsuit against Steed followed.

    Brian Barnard, Jones’s attorney told ABC 4,

    “You use that taser when someone is in danger, you don’t use a taser to gain compliance.”

    **********************
    By November 2012, Lisa Steed had lost her credibility and was fired:

    Utah officials move to fire controversial trooper Lisa Steed

  59. @Charles Liu

    In the case of Nashua police, they have a track record of brutality extending back over many years. Google “Nashua Police Brutality” and you will see many ghits. Here are a few:

    1987: Nashua Police Investigating Brutality Charges

    1987: Nashua Police Again Charged with Brutality (a different incident than above)

    ***********************
    2001: Unity pushes back police brutality

    “Police harassment and violence against an oppressed community often seem too overpowering to fight or change. For years, the virtually all-white police force in Nashua, N.H., has been routinely subjecting the local Latino and African American communities to racist profiling with total impunity. All communities of color as well as the lesbian, gay, bi and trans community have faced false arrest and brutality.

    Until recently, that is.

    For nine months Nashua’s Committee for Social Justice has been defending the Tirado family against false charges of resisting arrest and assaulting a police officer in New Hampshire’s most racially diverse city. When a nearly complete victory was reached in District Court here on May 21, months of protest in the streets proved that a fightback against police brutality can be successful.

    On Aug. 13 last year the Nashua police-in what the presiding judge deemed to be a racist act-pulled over Juan Tirado Jr. and asked him to produce his license, claiming he was another man. It turned out that the other person had been in jail for the past two weeks.

    Despite showing his license, the police continued to harass Tirado, his brother Jonathon and a friend, chasing them into the family home and waking up his parents, who tried to defend their sons from the attack. The police proceeded to arrest the entire family. They broke an arm of Carmen Tirado, Juan’s mother.

    Carmen Tirado had to wait two hours in a cold police cell before she was allowed to go to an emergency room for treatment.

    An enraged community began to organize immediately, picketing Nashua District Court on several occasions and circulating petitions. No one in the community could remember anyone ever picketing a court here or organizing against police violence.

    Several community support meetings were held. On May 19, some 50 Latino, African American, Filipino and gay people turned out to hear stirring speeches from Ikoni Ngongi, president of the Manchester NAACP; Bob Traynham, Local 875 USWA; and Frank Neisser from the International Action Center in Boston.

    They all encouraged the community to keep fighting back. Three days later the judge issued his ruling stating that the police work was “sloppy” and “full of discrepancies.” It was a subdued way of saying racist and full of lies.

    The family was found not guilty on all but one of the nine charges against them. That one will be appealed, paving the way for a suit against the police.

    The Committee for Social Justice will continue its work in Nashua to demand a community police review board.”

    **************************
    2004: New Hampshire Man Settles for $80,000 for Excessive Force by Police

    Michael Pelhaus, a resident of Pelham, New Hampshire, reached a settlement of $80,000 with the city of Nashua, New Hampshire to resolve a suit in which he claimed that a traffic stop in the city in 2004 led to several personal injuries. When officers stopped him, they claimed that he tried to run them over in his van, prompting the officers to shoot at him, wounding his hand and resulting in the loss of an index finger. Pelhaus also alleges that officers broke his nose during the arrest. After being convicted and serving 10 months for charges of reckless conduct, leaving the scene of an accident, resisting arrest, disobeying police, and driving after suspension, Pelhaus sued the police department for civil rights violations. He alleged that the officers used excessive force when they arrested him.

    *******************************
    2006: The Geddes/Nashua Police Brutality case.

    *********************************
    2011: Suspects, witness dispute police version of July 1 arrest in Nashua

    This incident has some similarities to the arrest of Ms Li. In this case, the individual was charged with being verbally abusive and resisting arrest. This characterization is disputed by the defendant. The arrested individual here was also attempting to videotape the officers’ actions:

    ““There goes corruption at its finest,” Gannon, 55, of 24 Temple St., admits he yelled back at the passing police detectives.

    That precipitated a chain of events in which Gannon was tackled, maced, handcuffed and then punched and kicked by two police detectives as he lay on the ground, according to Gannon and two witnesses, Pamela Reynolds, who was also arrested, and her boyfriend, Brian Raymond.

    All three say Gannon didn’t resist arrest, only turned his back and began to walk away from the detectives after being told he wasn’t under arrest.

    “I didn’t have time to resist,” Gannon said.

    The two detectives were on him immediately, he said.

    He and the other two witnesses said police overreacted to his wisecrack.”

    *******************************
    2011: Man Made Famous Over 2006 Arrest For Videotaping Police… Arrested Again While Videotaping Police

    *******************************
    2011: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=K_OjHqOdSS0#!
    Nashua PD Protects Criminals

    *******************************

    2012: http://www.copblock.org/tag/nashua-police-department/

    *******************************

    The numerous incidents suggests that the violence we saw against Ms Li is just a small piece of a broader pattern of excessive force and violence in the Nashua Police Department.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Time limit is exhausted. Please reload the CAPTCHA.