This blog may be taken as a second part my Collective Defamation article (with possible further blogs in the future involving other kinds of anti-sinitic defamation). It is inspired by recent events blogged by Charles Liu. Another vicious slander that is common in the west is that the Chinese are a cruel people. The image is made visceral, rage inducing, when a cute animal is shown being killed or tortured. These kinds of images are often made focusing on Chinese people as the perpetrators. This is an effective image that serves to single out and dehumanize the Chinese as a group and it is very effective.
A google search exposed the commonality of this meme. Comments from stories of abuse of animals in China include outright calls to commit genocide against Chinese or to target Chinese people for violent hate crimes. Just from the recent example of the fabricated Dailymail story of polar bear hunting by wealthy Chinese, comments from western “animal activists” include
SHOOT ALL THESE WICKED CRUEL PEOPLE.. THE WORLD DOES NOT NEED THEIR GREED & DISPICABLE WAYS
WHAT A DISGRACE TO THE WORLD THESE KILLER CHINESE SCUM ARE.
i’d be interested in spending $80k on a trip to hunt chinese businessmen?
I would like to chase people down in a car all the while dodging my bullets. Teach them a lesson! Stop this!
someone should create a company offering animal rights activists (or any animal lover) the unique chance to hunt the ignorant and greedy elites who enjoy trophy hunting (preferably of the Chinese variety since they are overpopulating the earth anyways) and feed them to endangered and exotic animals.
it just beggars belief the depth of inhumanity to the worlds endangered animals this country will sink to for useless medicines and now sport they should hang their heads in shame and so should we for letting them get away with it…..
I could go on and on. These are not unusual comments and are actually very common not only in the comments section of this story but in the public reactions of almost all other similar stories.
It’s a common stereotype among whites that is created by their media that Chinese people are a cruel race especially towards animals. Some people have even argued that it is because of Chinese culture that the Chinese are so “cruel”. However, these people usually make no specific references to elements within Chinese society that induces this “cruelty.” This shouldn’t be surprising as the people alleging that are likely completely ignorant of China, its people and its culture. Some Chinese people inside China may also buy into this nonsense. Some prominent white animal rights activists have argued that the Chinese are an inherently cruel people.
But the reality is that western nations are far more cruel to animals than China (see a good example this in recent news). Hunting, including hunting of all kinds of bears, is very popular in the west. In the US south, dog fighting and chicken fighting (despite being illegal in most states) are widely practiced. Most hunters, even far more than their overall representation in the US population, are indeed, whites.
See this image search.
Sport fishing is popular among the whole country, especially among whites (one of the most common pastimes in fact). The western countries kill and eat far more meat, poultry and fish per capita than China does. Animals suffer many years in CAFOS (concentrated feeding operations) before being slaughtered for their meat. Most of the most productive fur and leather producing companies in the world are western companies (e.g. Nike). Milk and egg production, a major cause of animal suffering is done far more in the west. Most of the animal testing is also done in the west. Animal experimentation and vivisection is common in bio-medical companies and institutions of higher learning (and high schools as well) in the west. Much of all this is occurring without racially directed attacks (or sometimes even any criticisms at all) at the perpetrators of those actions.
You will never see people ascribing cruelty to animals in the west to either western culture or the supposed innate cruelty of westerners. This kind of rampant racism against the Chinese people is so common and accepted that mainstream media often make these kinds of slanderous accusations at the whole Chinese nation, defaming its culture and people and no one bats an eye.
No connection to western culture is made from these examples of cruelty despite the fact that the Judeo-Christian culture (from Biblical pronouncements) see animals, and in fact all of nature, as created by god for Man’s use. Despite the long history of vegetarianism in China that is not mirrored in the history of the west, the media often draws a link to the supposed more ethical treatment of animals in the west to its culture. The west is portrayed as humane, kind to animals when that is far from the truth. As Jeremy Rifkin pointed out in many of his books, the Christian and pagan rituals of sacrificing, torturing and eating animals has a long history in western culture that continues in the practices today (think about the thanksgiving meal).
Taiwan has some of the strictest vegetarian labeling and food processing laws in the world and one of the largest vegetarian populations as a percentage of total population. Mainland China is also instituting a more vegetarian society with prime minister Wen Jiabao in 2010 proposing a nation wide campaign advocating at least one day of vegetarianism a week. Vegetarian only restaurants are common in much of Asia including the Chinese countries (PRC, Taiwan, Singapore, Hong Kong, Malaysia, etc). One can only imagine the vitriol spewed by the US public (not to mention the meat industry) if American politicians dare advocate a similar limiting of meat consumption for the US population.
No one bothers to ask why white people act so despicably towards animals, why they are so abominably cruel despite the long, well-established history that continues to this day of systematic animal cruelty in western cultures. No one bothers to ask if it is an inherent character flaw in white people to behave in this way. (The very long history of genocide, war, slavery, imperialism, etc perpetrated by whites against others are also not raised as evidence for their inherent cruelty)
One factor behind the virulent hatred against the Chinese in these types of cases is a kind of animal specieism. Some non-human animal species are seen by the west as non edible (cats, dogs, some birds, etc), engendering gustatory disgust when images of people eating them is displayed. It is seen as taboo to eat certain kinds of animals. This disgust is then mutated into hatred and self-righteous indignation directed at those who dare to eat them. Other animals (pigs, cows, chickens, fish, etc) are fit for slaughter. But since the Chinese don’t share that cultural bias they are subject to the selective targeting of that indignation.
Also, the west is a master at image manipulation and self-denial with much of its cruelty towards animals hidden behind the walls of slaughter houses and fur farms away from the eyes of the public many of whom will gladly indulge in a burger or a fur coat after spewing racist epithets at Chinese for “cruelty.” Animal abuse from the Chinese is more often, not so hidden because meat is often not purchased from slaughter houses but individual butchers. A kind of systematic hypocrisy underlies this voluntary shielding from the conscience in the west. Cruelty is acceptable once it is out of the mind’s eye. People in the west know their meat comes from animals slaughtered but so long as you don’t see it, people are absolved of any guilt or shame. But because other people may not be such hypocrites or at least come from a society where it is not feasible to systematically hide all the cruelty, it becomes something visible in the mind’s eye and where it exists there, it becomes unacceptable to hypocrites because it forces them to reflect on their own cruelty.
Examples in recent memory of videos (also see here, here, here, here, here, here, e.g.) and images (here, here, here, here, e.g.) of whites, torturing, mutilating and killing animals are individualized to the person, not his or her race.
The popular Canadian pastime of clubbing baby seals to death and the Norwegian pastime of killing whales and dolphins are seen as cultural quarks, barbaric, maybe, but isolated to smaller groups or individuals, not to the respective national groups or to all western peoples. The long tradition of the British of chasing foxes with dogs for days and killing said foxes by letting the dogs rip the animals to pieces (similar to the American pastime of hunting hogs) are often seen as a gentile “sport,” a little violent maybe but definitely not cruel, many of the same people that direct their vitriol at the Chinese may think. English animal rights activist do not see themselves as a “subspecies” for these barbaric practices like they do when Chinese people are found to have abused animals. The long history in Spain of slowly torturing and killing bulls in bullfights or their barbaric slaughtering of sheep and geese in public festivals are not put into question as an expression of inherent cruelty of the Spanish people. The trapping, torturing and slaughter of American alligators is made into popular entertainment in the US but genocidal vitriol is not then stoked towards Americans or white people in general.
Even many other minority groups are treated with far more consideration and leniency when members of those groups are caught mistreating animals. Consider the situation with the NFL quarterback Michael Vick who was caught breeding fighting dogs and forcing them to fight each other. Or the practice of hunting for “bushmeat” by some Africans. Or this auction in a predominantly black African country for the rights to hunt a rhino (the story said that the principle buyers of the rhino hunting license are American and “wealthy white men”). There are plenty of racist criticism directed at blacks for these incidents and practices but that racist criticism is rarely so casually accepted by the general mainstream society like it is when directed against Chinese people. One can hardly imagine an article in the mainstream media with the title “Are blacks the cruelest race on earth?” (or any other group name substituted in place of “Chinese”)
Chinese people are seen as so despicable and subhuman by the western public that even other minorities, the victims of centuries of discrimination, are treated with far more humanity and empathy. Members of those groups are more individualized. Acts of cruelty are isolated rather than endemic to the whole group.
Still, one wonders if the animals rights activists or their on-and-off supporters (on when it comes to racist denunciations, off when it comes to the dinner table) are not so much interested in the welfare of animals in these situations but have ulterior motives behind their “activism.” Perhaps the motive is more of a festering racism that is only waiting for the closest opportunity, a pretext, to surface its angry, ugly head. Many of these so called animal rights activists hide behind a veneer of liberalism which protects them from any criticism of racism. But self-described liberals are some of the most racist people because they do not see racism as “their” problem. So they have no problems with dehumanizing or even advocating for hate crimes against Chinese people at the slightest provocation.
Reading this post, I immediately thought of Whale Wars and the anti-Japanese whaling movement. The situations and stereotypes of Chinese are much worse, but you get the same feeling that some people in that movement just want to protest against the orientals.
There’s probably a similar sentiment in the human rights movement, i.e. Chinese people have no respect for human life, they’re all killing each other anyway, so why not kill them. Actually, the racist impact of the human rights movement is more serious, since the animal rights movement is still somewhat fringe among Westerners; a SWPL phenomenon if you will.
Nice job on “anti-sinitic” by the way. I’ll be sure to use it more often.
Don’t you know? The Chinese is now the new Jew. All the worst racist stereotype ever put on the Jew are now used on the Chinese with impunity.
Basically, the logic is, killing them all is doing humanity a service. Thanks for writing a good rebuttal.
Actually, the racist impact of the human rights movement is more serious, since the animal rights movement is still somewhat fringe among Westerners
Actually I disagree with this. The thing is active particiaption in some sort of animal rights group is not a pre-requisite for liking animals. Westerners will be outraged over Chinese treatment of animals whether or not they are a signed up member of PETA or Sea Shepherd or whatever.
In fact I think apparent animal rights violations is going to stir up more hatred against Chinese than so called ‘human’ rights violations.
Because to tell the truth, Westerners do not really care about the human rights of CHinese. They just enjoy bringing attention to so-called human rights abuses, as a way of proclaiming their own moral superiority over non-white barbarians, and as a tool to subvert CHina.
But really. Most Westerners do not care that a Chinese kills a Chinese, or an African an African.
But most Westerners really do care, if they see a Chinese kill an animal (even though they do it themselves).
Westerners genuinely care more for the lives of bears, cats, dogs, than they do Chinese people.
So focussing on alleged Chinese abuse of animals, really does stir up visceral racial rage among Westerners.
You are 100% right Ray.
The nature of the propaganda against Chinesenow is reminiscent to that which was used by the Nazis to attack Jews, and would do Goebbels proud.
Some of the urban myths about Chinese treatment of animals are appalling.
For example, the idea that Chinese torture dogs to death improves the taste. This is just such utter bullshit, but you can find it everywhere in the Western media.
They take a single situation where an animal may not have been killed cleanly, and then make it out that all Chinese want to torture animals.
Its like taking some isolated incidents in slaughterhouses in the West (animal rights groups have these videos) of animals being abused, and then saying all Westerners are sadistic and cruel – even though the vast majority are probably not even aware of these abuses.
Of course in rural areas, and poor countries, methods of slaughter may be more primitive and less efficient. But so it is in the West in rustic areas, where live pigs on farms are still clubbed to death with a big club, turned over and then stuck in the throat.
But the CHinese I know who keep pets are probably more sentimental over them than Westerners are over theirs.
” I immediately thought of Whale Wars and the anti-Japanese whaling movement. “
Yes, the Westerners attack all ‘orientals’ for their apparent cruelty towards animals.
The hypocrisy over whaling is disgusting.
It is a simple fact that the vast majority of blame for driving whales to extinction can be attributed to Westerners.
Yet now these Westerners who fucked up the whales in the first place, turn around and racially bash Asians for taking a tiny, sustainable, quota every year.
And of course the focus is on the Japanese. Not the Norwegians, Icelanders, or Faroe Islanders.
In fact the Faroe Islands pilot whale hunt is exactly of the same nature as the Japanese dolphin hunts.
Yet the latter gets about 100000 x more publicity in the West.
“It is seen as taboo to eat certain kinds of animals. This disgust is then mutated into hatred and self-righteous indignation directed at those who dare to eat them. Other animals (pigs, cows, chickens, fish, etc) are fit for slaughter. But since the Chinese don’t share that cultural bias they are subject to the selective targeting of that indignation.”
An excellent article.
Pigs are every bit as sentient, if not more so, than dogs. Yet Westerners have no qualms about pork as a staple food. And pigs are kept in appalling conditions in the West every bit as bad as bear bile farms in China. Millions and millions of them.
And then what about horses, another highly intelligent and sentient animal. Horse meat is a delicacy in many parts of Europe and the horse meat trade is disgusting for its cruelty. Horses are transported throughout Europe in atrocious conditions, beaten, prodded, and stuffed into dark, airless carriages. Just google it.
The fact is the average European, by his per capita meat consumption, as mentioned in the article above, is responsible for far more animal suffering than the average Chinese or East Asian.
Personally I am against killing the higher more sensitive animals for food. I think that killing a dog or a pig is more cruel than say a chicken or a fish. A dog or a pig is simply more aware of pain, particularly emotional, than a chicken or a fish.
I am lazy. I am against eating dogs and cats, but I eat pork. If I was consistent I would also not eat pork, and beef also.
Because even cows have highly developed emotions. I was once driving behind a herd of cows. I saw one cow trip over and fall down. And another cow came up and nuzzled it and was obviously concerned. It was extremely moving and I think if people reflected more on the suffering we cause to animals it would make us feel very uncomfortable.
Hahahaha, your guys posts are getting loopier and loopier.
The icing on the cake is the impotent rants by our flaccid friend Wayne..
“And then what about horses, another highly intelligent and sentient animal. Horse meat is a delicacy in many parts of Europe and the horse meat trade is disgusting for its cruelty.”
Hey Wayney, horse meat is also a popular food in parts of China, where it is traded. So are the Chinese also “disgusting for their cruelty”?
Maybe you should be more worried about this kind of stuff. Chinese people in the US destroying the image of other Chinese with dishonest nefarious schemes such as this.
“Don’t you know? The Chinese is now the new Jew. All the worst racist stereotype ever put on the Jew are now used on the Chinese with impunity.”
Cry me a river Ray….
Aren’t you glad that this is the case? Try to deny that this is not a fact.
Racist would glee while a real human of compassion and reason would be appalled. Thanks for showing us your true colours.
Hey Wayney, horse meat is also a popular food in parts of China, where it is traded. So are the Chinese also “disgusting for their cruelty”?
I’m pointing out hypocrisy. My main point is not to try to prove who is better or worse when it comes to the ethical treatment of animals. I’m not really into some sort of game of one-upmanship.
Although if one looks to the history and culture of the East, it is obvious that animals have, in the main, been treated better in the East than in the West. Western consumption of animal products is far higher in the West than in the East.
If one considers the religions of the east, vegetarianism (something quite new in the West), the anthroprocentrism of Western religions (even Jesus had no compunction about driving a herd of swine off a cliff to die what would undoubtedly have been painful deaths), this is quite obvious.
But my main point is the West does not have a leg to stand on when it points the finger towards the East. Westerners who say the Chinese are uniquely cruel towards animals are nothing but racist hypocrites.
Rather than different groups accuse one another of cruelty, it is better that all peoples, from the West and the East, come together and work towards more ethical treatment of animals everywhere.
Americans and other Westerners consume on average 120 kg of meat per year compared with 53 kg/year for Chinese, 46 kg/year for Japanese, 56 kg/year for South Koreans. Note that Japan and South Korea are highly industrialised. So their low meat consumption is more related to culture, not lack of means to eat more meat.
Obviously it is white people who are the most disgusting in treatment of animals and who are really the “cruellest race in the world”. Almost as disgusting as their treatment of animals is their racist hypocrisy.
Worldwide annual meat consumption
Whites are nothing but a bunch of racist hypocrites.
I’d much rather send 1000000 Anglo Saxon filth to the slaughterhouse than 100 sheep.
[Editor: I decided to embed the chart provided in the link above by Wayne]
Charles Liu says
WRT treatment of food animals in the west, the industrialized cruelty from our intense factory farming practice is far worse than anything the Chinese do, both in terms of scale and severity.
Damn Wayne, you have gone way too far. Eating less meat isn’t necessarily a good thing! Many credit meat consumption to improve early homo sapiens’ brain power. We won’t be where we are as a species without being carnivores. Your data is a bit dated. Including beef, pork, poultry & seafood, China consumes close to 100 kg per person each year. That’s about the same as EU-27, and only 29% less than the US.
Why China was #1 or #2 in the medal tables of the recent Olympic Games, and India was nowhere to be found. The major reason, quite possibly is meat consumption. Per person per year India consumes low 10% of what China consumes.
BTW, can you please cut out sending people to the slaughter house?
It is wrong to condemn the whole White race as racist. That is simply not true.
Suggesting people be sent to slaughter house is insane and tantamount to hate speech.
You should seriously reflect what you are saying. Honestly, we are simply too busy to babysit the forum.
Charles Liu says
Agree, two Wongs don’t make a Wright 😎
You know, you remind me of Linus from the comic strip Peanuts. He’s a great orator who’s capable of making great points and keeping people’s attention, until he starts mentioning about “the Great Pumpkin”. That’s where his listeners start to get turned off. Likewise, “the Great Pumpkin(s)” you have in your rhetoric are a) violence against another group of people or b) the “selling out” of Chinese women / emasculation of the Chinese people.
This is how I would argue in response to racist comments like that exposed in the topic:
“WHAT A DISGRACE TO THE WORLD THESE KILLER CHINESE SCUM ARE”
According to facts that are revealed in our discussion and the logic of this person, Americans are as much a disgrace, if not more a disgrace to the world.
“SHOOT ALL THESE WICKED CRUEL PEOPLE.. THE WORLD DOES NOT NEED THEIR GREED & DISPICABLE WAYS”
Again if you want to shoot, then all peoples who slaughter and torment animals should be open game; but bear in mind you’ll be charged for murder if you ever do that.
Just FYI – Today I deleted two 500-word comments left by Wayne on my blog calling for a Babi Yar-style massacre of Chinese women with white husbands/boyfriends and mixed-race children, going into graphic detail as to how each killing was to be done, particularly the killing of the children and of the pregnant women. The guy is unhinged.
@Charles – However, two Wrights did make the first aeroplane . . .
Who cares. It probably takes more effort for him to write it than you deleting it.
Talking about meat, another thing that the Western Propaganda don’t mention much about is why the US meat is ‘meatier’ and ‘tastier’ than Chinese meat. Besides the usual cocktail of hormones they pumped into them, a lesser known substance that they feed cows and pigs right before slaughter is called Ractopamine. This stuff is essentially the less potent form of clenbuterol and is banned in 160 countries including China and Taiwan. Somehow this kind of meat ends up in Hong Kong and sneaked up to China.
Glen Beck says
Isnt this site dedicated to pointing out what some people see as unfair and untrue speech by others denigrating a specific group? Surely the hosts of this site, regular posters here, and in fact any reasonable person should care, or am I missing something?
I mean seriously, if someone does have something interesting to say sometimes, some useful insights, but it it interspersed with violent threats and hate speech, then this is not acceptable, and is grounds for not giving this person a platform to spew their vitriol?
I’m sure it must turn off a lot of potential readers and people who may otherwise be inclined to comment…certainly it has for me.
Hugh Grigg says
This really resonates, actually. I’m increasingly starting to see just how much most Western media subscribes to this narrow, anti-China portrayal. The more you know the more obvious it becomes.
Wayne, I hope you will tone down some of what you say. I know some of it is theatrics on the blog – but some of it is not – which can be offensive.
The big picture is this, what is history is history. I think the West has done tremendous harm to China. But the thing is what to do about it. If we Chinese are still slaves to the West, some of what you say makes sense. We need someone to lead us out of bondage. However, even though there are lots of misunderstanding between China and West – and even if West does many things to subvert China even today – the thing is that we Chinese have never been more in control of our destiny today than anytime in the last couple of hundred years. So let’s build a future that befits out tradition. If we are into revenge mentality, we will still be defined by the West. To be free, we need to step out of the shadow of those atrocities and be ourselves. I personally don’t ascribe much of what happened to China to bad, evil West – I simply ascribe it to our weakness. Remember, it was not only the West that pillaged China – it was Japan also. If given a chance, perhaps Vietnam and Korea would be so cruel to the rest of Asia as well. It’s about civilization and governance. When a civilization falls, people suffer. It’s a worthwhile lesson to learn.
Thanks for dropping a note.
Some of the comments here may be hateful of the West – which is not the intent of this blog. I think people here should take you and others who visit us as an example. There are conscientious Westerners – and many Westerners who are willing to experiment seeing things from our perspective (even if they don’t agree 100% with us. Hateful words only make us look silly and turn those people away…
Charles Liu says
I think the digression of comments in these two threads are perfect illustrations of how the cause, may it be awareness of polar bear, or demonization of Chinese, are obfuscated by less than open honest communication, and how visceral reactions totally detracted from the issue one advocates.
There’s truth to this but one has to keep in mind that a lot of the criticisms of the Chinese in these stories do not come from strictly speaking animal rights activists but also their supporters. I see lots of racism in the general public and in the animal rights movement in the west but since the public outnumbers animal rights people by a large number, many ant-Chinese statements are actually from the public.
There are real practices in the west that are similar to the made up images of animal torture that you speak of. Take the harvesting of foie gras. This is basically bloated geese liver. It is harvested by first force feeding the geese with a tube shoved down its throat. The geese live its entire life living in its own feces being force fed only to be killed for its bloated liver. Just so some rich Frenchman could get to eat a bloated liver he considers a delicacy, a goose has to suffer a life time of pain. But no one wants to talk about the French being culturally or innately defective for this practice.
Fucking bullshit. I did not write that comment. These people will do everything to try and denigrate and disparage Chinese people.
Apologies YinYang. I will not write such stuff from now on, it is your site and I don’t want to detract from the main message.
FOARP is known for lying about what others have said – or take what others have said out of context.
Accepted. The Western world is blanketed with a thick cloud of propaganda about our world. You have a rare gift in cutting through that. You can count me and other contributors and readers of this blog among your fans. We have to sincerely seek win-win with the Western audience that that propaganda is not healthy for the world nor the West.
We sympathize with your SPAM problem, FOARP, but unfortunately, we have our own problems, and not much we can do to help with yours.
We unfortunately, have a few Trolls who come by with about 200 comments of 5-word SPAMs!
You don’t see us complaining to your forum about the trolls, do you?
“Fucking bullshit. I did not write that comment. These people will do everything to try and denigrate and disparage Chinese people.”
Ummm Wayne but you’ve written the same type of comments here on this blog. In fact you apologize for just such a thing in your very next post….by your definition you are denigrating and disparaging the Chinese people.
As for whether your posts represent the Chinese citizenry, well I dont think any Chinese citizen outside a straight-jacket would feel comfortable with that.
“well I dont think any Chinese citizen outside a straight-jacket would feel comfortable with that.”
Are you speaking as one who IS in a “straight-jacket”? Because you don’t sound very sure. 🙂
This Bazza troll is likely that same porn troll a while back. If he is not adding to the discussion, just push his comments into the spam queue.
Bazza is an alternate trolling account for Baz, no?
1 of many alternate troll names/identities for the same troll.
Talk about a troll with personal issues and no life whatsoever.
Well, I guess that’s happens in the West when young trolls can’t find jobs.
The main reason I do not like China Smack is that it never misses an opportunity to show animal cruelty as though it is unique to China.
According to a joke told by Comedian Lewis Black,
Dick Cheney and his rich pals went hunting in a “petting zoo” for quails. The birds have their wings clipped, and can barely fly, and the hunting place is fenced so that the birds can’t even run out of the place.
Black said, that’s not F*ing “hunting”. To “hunt”, one should hunt something like a “Bear”, something that can “eat your feet”.
Ironically, at least by Mr. Black’s standards, if Rich Chinese are hunting “polar bears”, that’s at least more real “hunting” than Dick Cheney hunting helpless clipped-winged birds.
But no one condemned Dick Cheney for his massacring of the helpless birds.
But hey, Rich Chinese people are apparently better “hunters” than Rich Westerners like Dick Cheney. And Putin hunts wild tigers!
Man, Westerners are getting so soft! Seriously, whining about Chinese hunting “polar bears”?!
The obvious trolling here is getting out of control 🙂
I often read these China related articles published in Western media, then try to substitute the word “Chinese” with “Jew” or “Blacks” and then imagine the outcry. Let’s be honest here, the articles about the polar bear killings and how “Chinese are the cruelest race on earth” will never be published if the “race” in question were “jews” or “blacks” by the main stream western media at least; they would only appear on stormfront types of sites.
Ultimately, I think the more we expose the biased media for what it is the better. People may laugh at say, anti-CNN, but if you look at the quality of the Chinese-related articles before and after anti-CNN came about it’s clear that the bias complaints have made some difference.
Yep, it can definitely make some difference. The economist is a good example too. They have gotten so many criticisms in the last few years on their reporting on China (even from their anglo readers) that they have published a little mea culpa of sorts recently about biased reporting on China they have done 100 years ago. They claim in that piece that their reporting is somewhat more accurate now. Possible, but it is only somewhat more accurate at most and it could be a lot better.
King Tubby says
As I noted elsewhere, Wayne is the Sino reincarnation of Charlie Mansion and he discredits any valid points made on this site. And there are valid points about US media bias, but they always get lost in the small praise chorus.
A bit of the usual exaggeration, isn’t it? King Tubby.
Charlie Mansion? I don’t think we convicted anyone in this forum.
By the same token, Baz and his sock puppets are not exactly shining examples of Internet etiquette coming from the anti china side. Trolling, flame baiting, thread hijacking, and general douchbaggery exhibited by Baz isn’t much better than Wayne’s racist rants. I would say that Baz baited wayne so that the later would post more garbage. Has anyone from the anti china side chided Baz for his behavior like some of us have done with Wayne?
You might have a point if anyone who is “anti-China” actually ever posted here.
You are right, FOARP. No, they don’t “post” here, they just keeping SPAMMING.
That was the racist remark on the Chinese made by the racist Australian Prime Minister in the early part of the 20th Century.
That was the racist remark on the Chinese made by the racist Australian Prime Minister in the early part of the 20th Century.
There sure is a lot of hate filled anti-western driveling nonsense here. I read through the blog post in its entirety and also all of the responses, and I’m left feeling completely at a loss as to where to start rebutting any of it. There is very little empirical evidence given to back up the torrent of anti-white and anti-western off-the-cuff statements that have been made to form this blog post and most of the comments. I mean.. google image search as a source? Deplorable quality at best. Not to mention some of the responses are tantamount to hate-speech and contain nothing enlightening at all.
Charles Liu says
Yet you have nothing to say about DM’s “Chinese are the cruelest race on earth” when no Chinese has ever hunted polar bear, according to DM’s own source?
Andy, feel free to come up with the goods if you think Google search (I didn’t use google image search) isn’t good enough. I challenge you to find one picture of a Chinese hunter posing with his trophy polar bear.
I will agree with you that the DM article is fabricated. But that wasn’t the point of my post. The point of my post was that your article is full of unsubstantiated points and racism.
By the way, you did actually use google image search as a source: “See this image search.”.
If there are a lot of “driveling nonsense,” then by all means point them out. Please stop trolling.
Now, if you feel some accusations are unsubstantiated, I am sure people will be happy to provide you link. If you can hold your ground, then use this forum to make your case.
I will also say this; pointing out individual cases of animal cruelty doesn’t actually prove anything. Two people can continuously point the finger at each others countries giving individual cases of cruelty as examples (for example, a westerner might show you this video of a live fish and snake cooking contest in China: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFelfDbkzm4) but at the end of the day an argument like this goes nowhere because there is no empirical evidence to compare between the two countries to come to a conclusion of any kind.
There are far too many to point out. Here’s one chosen completely at random:
“Most of the most productive fur and leather producing companies in the world are western companies (e.g. Nike). Milk and egg production, a major cause of animal suffering is done far more in the west. Most of the animal testing is also done in the west.”
The author has actually done a hat trick here. Three claims in a row, with no sources for any of them.
Edit: I’m going to leave it there because it’s 2.30am here in Taiwan and I really can’t be bothered. Good luck to you.
You are just plain stupid. The article is a respond to a fake story. It is common fact that who has the highest meat consumption in the world:
The author is not anti-west but simply pointing out hyprocracy and double standard. Basically, you are one of those the west can do no wrong preacher. For example when you got all riled up when you see this article but have no reaction towards the false news that was circualted in paid mainstream western press.
You are “at a loss” because you are lost.
No shit single cases don’t “prove anything”. That’s the whole fuckin point, Sherlock.
Listen to your own advice, dim, single cases like that do not prove anything for the whole population.
Charles Liu says
No I did not. Here’s my blogpost:
Show me one example of racism that’s not west to east? BTW were able to find better evidence than Google Images that show Chinese hunting polar bear?
Charles Liu says
Andy, I hope your sense of justice is more than mere “do not necessarily disagree with” when it comes to blatant fabrication like the “Chinese cruelest race for hunting polar bear” propaganda. Again have you been able to find a better example than Google Image search which you object?
I also do not agree with your “nonsense” assessment. What’s been said is the larger truth – the cruelty of intensive factory farming practices in the west exceeds anything the Chinese does, both in terms of severity and scale. This is a fact not up for debate.
Black Pheonix says
You are on notice.
Repeatedly asking for proof without offering a counter-argument is harassment.
If you have FACTS of your own to make a point, make it.
Otherwise, you have no point to make, and you are spamming this forum.
Anyone that asks for “proof” regarding the obvious FACT that the vast majority of anglers in the US are non hispanic whites is a moron.
that doesn’t require any kind of proof because it is so obvious that it needs no proof. All the other claims I made in the post ARE supported this this piece of fuckin shit is clearly a troll. It would be like asking for “proof” that most nurses in the US are women. It needs no proof because anyone with two brain cells to rub together knows that to be a fact.
And yes, if you look for it, there is plenty of evidence to support the FACT that most anglers in the US are non hispanic whites.
here’s just one example
on p. 18
Whites are overwhelmingly the majority among sport fishermen. THAT’S A FACT, BITCH.
Non Hispanic whites are 82.4% of sport fishermen in the US yet make up 64% of the population.
Nothing I said was untrue. All supported by FACTS.
Get lost, chump.
Because you spend time checking your facts, I really don’t think that such offense words help.
Great. here comes the obscenity police…
gonna boot that troll
Black Pheonix says
Back to the point of the original post.
I think it’s pretty clear that the West had a prevailing wind of xenophobia and foreigner-bashing, for a long time. I don’t know why Custer and others would find it odd that Chinese people might actually bash back, especially against those who propagate these types of xenophobic stories about Chinese people.
(and yes, it was one of those “expat journalists” Peter Simpson who spread such BS lies about China).
Why are posts like this allowed to stay?
Black Pheonix says
He had his say, and that’s reflection on him.
Mister Unknown says
Hmm… I’m browsing all the older blog posts & this one attracted my commentary given my personal experiences with the matter. I recall two years ago a few widely seen videos on YouTube showed a Chinese cooking show in which the fish being consumed was still moving (the mouth was still opening/closing) after being plated & served on the table. Needless to say, there was no shortage of comments about how cruel Chinese people are for supposedly frying fish “alive”.
So seeing all this non-sense, I wrote a few comments pointing out the fact that the fish isn’t really “alive”, since all its internal organs were removed prior to cooking. We know this because we clearly see demonstration videos where cooks removed the organs, we also clearly see that the cooked fish had a large opening cut into the belly section. I also mentioned that the fish that was supposedly cooked “alive” went through a far quicker death than slowly suffocating on the deck of a fishing trawler (which is what would normally happen when Alaskan fishermen catch salmon. I further pointed out that this is far less cruel than the western tradition of hunting for sport. I can understand the necessity of hunting for food/survival, but hunting for sport is essentially the act of killing animals for fun.
You guys should’ve seen the barrage of abuses I received for making those comments, all of which completely ignored the facts I presented. One commentator reached the point of absurdity after he failed to make fact-based arguments, & stated that it doesn’t matter that the fish is actually dead, since Chinese people are “cruel” for “thinking” that the fish is alive while eating it. Let’s assume that were true – you can be labeled as “cruel” for thinking “cruel” thoughts & imagining “cruel” situations. If imagination is the standard, then American culture must be the cruelest one out there, judging by the type of video games they play (i.e. Call of Duty, Fallout, you name it), where American kids are constantly imagining (& glorifying) the slaughter of human beings in countless ways.
Nevertheless, it’s amazing to see the degree to which supposedly “free and enlightened” people will dogmatically hold their prejudices in the face of all fact & reason.
Here is an article titled “2 Investigators: China Floods U.S. With Near-Perfect Fake Driver’s Licenses”.
So it’s just another story of how police have broken another local ring of conterfeits. But note the title, the focus is on how China floods U.S. with these illicit goods. It’s not about the demand of these goods, but the supplies.
Remember those stories about rhino horns, tiger skins, shark fins especially finding their way to China? The story was never about illicit poachers flooding Chinese market with illicit good … but about Chinese insatiable appetite for insatiable goods. There it’s always about the demand … not the supply.
Going back to the opium war, the flooding of China with opium was always deemed to be a “natural” thing – where local Chinese willingly demanded produce that British controlled India happened to supply. It was about the demand … not the supply.
See how morality can be so easily washed. The same fact patterns … very different morality. As a side note, such is the power of “framing” … and it is the essence of what rhetoric … and hence “rule of law” is all about.